Is there demand for a "FreeBSD Kommunity Edition"?

  • Yes, sure

    Votes: 20 18.9%
  • Likely

    Votes: 12 11.3%
  • Maybe

    Votes: 10 9.4%
  • Doubtfully

    Votes: 10 9.4%
  • No

    Votes: 44 41.5%
  • Don't know

    Votes: 10 9.4%

  • Total voters
I think we do have the tools for a reasonably pain-free upgrade, without having to figure out how to fight stuff like dependency hell, compile-time options, and run-time options, but somebody needs to figure out how to line it all up. And right now, the challenge is to drum up the interest, and do some problem-solving at different points. Rome wasn't built in a day, people! (oh, and FWIW, KDE has quite a few devs based in Italy! :p )
Reading up on Poudriere, it looks like it can be told to build just KDE against existing deps, but that happens just inside the jail. Is it possible to fish packages out of that jail? Assuming I run my poudriere session like grahamperrin:
Once x11/kde5 finishes compiling, I exit the jail... where would I find the poudriere-generated packages to install? Going by the available dump, would that be /usr/local/poudriere/data/.m/main-default/ref/ + /var/db/pkg = /usr/local/poudriere/data/.m/main-default/ref/var/db/pkg?

Or am I going down the road to nowhere?
% pwd
% ls -hl
total 1
-rw-r--r--  1 root  wheel   207B 16 May 09:31 base.conf
-rw-r--r--  1 root  wheel    30B  1 Feb  2019 FreeBSD.conf
-rw-r--r--  1 root  wheel   149B 11 Jul 19:05 poudriere.conf
% cat poudriere.conf
    "poudriere": {
        "url": "file:///usr/local/poudriere/data/packages/main-default",
        "enabled": true,
        "priority": 4

In your case the URL will probably might be different.

(I named my jail main because I work with FreeBSD 14.0-CURRENT.)
Reading up on Poudriere, it looks like it can be told to build just KDE against existing deps, but that happens just inside the jail. Is it possible to fish packages out of that jail? Assuming I run my poudriere session like grahamperrin:
Once x11/kde5 finishes compiling, I exit the jail... where would I find the poudriere-generated packages to install? Going by the available dump, would that be /usr/local/poudriere/data/.m/main-default/ref/ + /var/db/pkg = /usr/local/poudriere/data/.m/main-default/ref/var/db/pkg?

Or am I going down the road to nowhere?
After reading the poudriere(8), I figured out the answer to my own question: /usr/local/poudriere/data/packages/!

Now my next couple questions:
Any ideas for generating the pkglist for poudriere to work with? I like enabling as many options as I can, but I do disable EXAMPLES, JAVA, clearly broken options, TESTS and F77. I do enable DOCS, MANPAGES. I did figure out how to deal with circular deps of graphviz/ruby/doxygen... I'd want to pre-compile as much as I can so that Poudriere only compiles the KDE ports I specify. I did figure out how to do a dry run with ports-mgmt/portmaster (inside a script session, and use a hella cryptic sed command to convert ./typescript into something for poudriere.

Updating: This is the big one, and may be related to generating the pkglist above in this post. Assuming I suceed in generating the pkglist for poudriere to compile, can the same list be fed to # portsnap fetch update?

A few hours down the road - and now it's looking like order matters: some pre-requisite ports need to be installed first, before I run make-config-recursive to prep the ports tree for portmaster!!!
Let's just brainstorm...
  • What would you expect a "FreeBSD Kommunity Edition" to be/offer?
  • What would you like it to be/offer?
  • Is there demand for such a thing?
  • Would you like to see a *BSD Kommunity Edition?
  • What is missing or should be better in base FreeBSD / in the KDE ports?
  • Add your topic...
Any reasonable feedback is welcome!
KDE Plasma on FreeBSD is just perfect also i prefer Qt Framework for programming i think everyone who starts learning about coding on FreeBSD or Linux should learn Qt first.
I voted no, i'm a noob still but my opinion : I use KDE as my Desktop graphic environment since I quite using Windows time ago, and I really like it i'm sold, but what i like about FreeBSD is that you can learn how to do it your self. I installed it and it work well, better then with Linux actually, truly, it's not to dislike Linux I liked Linux too and still like Linux, I'm gonna install a debian again on an other machine to do other thing, cause if I came to bsd it's to learn about unix and how it work because of the manual page and the documentation and the fact that this is a true os. It seem to me that what you have in mind is kind of kubuntu. what I like is to learn how it work and not have it all arrange for me. and the documentation is there for me, so it doesn't correspond to my wants and my need. Ubuntu was my first try in the unix like world after 6 mount I switched to Debian, cause I didnt like the way ubuntu kubuntu and so on was. ... I dont think that correspond to FreeBSD to have a kubuntu like community for kde in freebsd. humbly.
Why not try gentoo.
Still have a lot to learn about Linux too, I'm not here because I exausted the possibility out there or because I'm better than Linus Torvalds or the wide Linux community; I just checked Gentoo it's seem a great distribution I might very well try it some day, thanks to mention it. When I first came to the Unix like world of OS I came through contingent circonstances (The whole story of my life😄) by a Ubuntu publicity on YouTube, I remember at that time I was trying to learn how windows was working, and I realized that I was going to be pretty limited. So I switched. Ubuntu was well, had a great bref experience there too, big community very lovable, and it does what they advertise for. But I wanted to go more at the sources so I learned that Ubuntu was derived from Debian so I stick with them, Debian, a while, learned a great deal there using it. There's alot of good Linux distributions I don't doubt it I just never had the time or never took it to check it out. But also, I have been always curious about BSD but more intimidated by it because overall it get very much less publicity then Linux and again FreeBSD make more publicity then OpenBSD and NetBSD and for the knowledge I have, I think it suits me better in the universe, then the others, that seem more less user-friendly if I could say and more technical. More for advanced admin and hacker. But I could be wrong, it's only my impression, I also know for example that NetBSD have a great deal of documentation. Recently I feeled more confident about my user admin skill n off to install FreeBSD so I just did it, not whitout taking a hit make a fool out of me and break everything but learned more and continue to learn this way. I'm reading a lot these days. I Will continue to do for a while. I'm really impressed by the manpages, their reputation is true, in Linux the manpages are not that well and it's not to dislike Linux they are not that bad too, I state honestly MY experience so far. And I found that the FreeBSD user handbook together with theses manpages is very well made and thought. Very instructive and generous, a power full tool to learn I feel, for example I didn't have that impression whit the Debian handbook which's great too, hope it will get even better. For my little experience accumulated with FreeBSD I really think we can see by the quality of this documentation combined with the quality of the user experience we get the quality of the community that is behind it. FreeBSD is very lovable.

I like the Unix world the free and open source, bsd or Linux it doesn't make a very big difference for me, much too learn. For example I know Linux is a kernel only I pretty much know nothing about it. But I feel I will learn about it with freebsd. It's my learning adventure in the Unix like OS that bring me here nothing else really.

That was a courtesy.

But to not deviate too much from the original post here that is why I don't think that a freebsd kumunity is needed or wanted. Me I don't want it. I want to learn BSD not just use it, I don't feel that KDE is the center of it but just another tool that work well, thanks to the maintainers, in it. And there too I have to learn cause I have not the knowledge yet too check the code and understand all the stuff for the KDE desktop environment that I like to use, but have some. But sure more contributors is not bad idea. KDE is great DE but not the center of my attention and I don't want it to be. I like the way I had to install it cause it make me learn more and the fact that it is a port. I like how I had to install FreeBSD, and that I was being free to install it, the DE, by the command line, and that it is minimal, FreeBSD, but not too much, well balanced, well maintained, and give ample room to learn about BSD and everything around it. Very great experience so far with FreeBSD the way it is for now. That's why I don't feel it's wanted nor needed to have a Kubuntu like community in FreeBSD. But I understand the entusiasm about KDE it's great DE in my opinion too, for older computer, XFCE is a very great one too.

Juste a simple user point of view. My point of view on that matter.

I doubt there is any notable demand in the FreeBSD community currently, as anyone already using FreeBSD who wants KDE Plasma has already set that up for themselves.

However, there is some small interest outside of the established FreeBSD user base for a GUI-centric BSD, as evidenced by the existence of GhostBSD, NomadBSD, PC-BSD (RIP), FuryBSD (RIP), and maybe a few others I can't think of right now.

I understand that the FreeBSD core team is primarily interested in developing the best general purpose OS they can, which doesn't include a GUI by default since not everyone is interested in that, and that's completely fine. It's a strength, even. And even for those that are interested in using FreeBSD as a workstation/desktop, there are plenty of options and preferences outside of a full scale desktop environment, and different desktop environments, and that's fine too so FreeBSD should probably keep away from establishing in preferred UI.

For those that are interested in creating a FreeBSD "spin" that dedicates itself to making sure the KDE Plasma is a first-class experience on FreeBSD, the existence of such a spin would benefit the community. It would both help those who already use KDE Plasma on FreeBSD set up their desktops and workstations more efficiently, and encourage greater adoption from those who don't currently use FreeBSD as a workstation OS by giving them a good first experience.

Not every Linux desktop user is technically-naive, there are quite a few savvy Linux users who, if they were to venture over to FreeBSD for a while, would benefit the FreeBSD ecosystem. If FreeBSD had a relatively low-effort way to install FreeBSD with a pre-configured decent KDE Plasma experience, that might help generate positive reviews and maybe attract some of that developer talent and energy.

I don't know if there is enough interest to sustain a dedicated KDE Plasma spin of FreeBSD outside of what is documented and supported by the FreeBSD KDE team, but if there were, I would be interested in helping. I already use KDE on FreeBSD, and have spent a good bit of time creating a poudriere repository with well options that make for a good experience for me.

I think a Kommunity edition is a fine thing to try, and if it doesn't take off then it doesn't take off. What it shouldn't do is try to fork FreeBSD in any way, but rather creating an overlay with some pre-configured packages and services that is easy to install.

Something like what sysutils/desktop-installer does, but is run at install time?
I think "freebsd Kommunity edition" is a nice idea, that will widen the appeal of the operating system! Personally I use windowmaker, but I'm a luddite dinosaur! I haven't tried KDE 6 yet, but saw a couple of reviews on youtube and it looks pretty good. Many new users aren't going to find windowmaker or fvwm very attractive compared to the usual eye-candy from other systems ;-)

There is one little fly in the ointment, which is a nasty little bug I found recently when using X11 and 14.0-RELEASE:
It would be nice if that could be fixed, to prevent video hardware acceleration being lost after suspend-resume or a VT switch. Or perhaps you are thinking of running kde on top of wayland only? Although even with wayland, I think there are still some remaining problems.
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I am still of the opinion that the best approach is an alternate installer for GUI users. If there were a community alternate installer that would be interesting. But a default GUI system based on FreeBSD already exists and is maintained, GhostBSD. I gave GhostBSD a try but it was more confusing to use as a new user to FreeBSD. The handbook makes it very easy to know what's going on with my systems and how to configure software for my system. Pre-configured user experiences can be nice but can also leave users with a lot of unused software to remove from their systems.
In standard freebsd you also have alot of options for desktops. They are not difficult to configure. Sometimes i use fvm3 or enlightenment using a .xinitrc . The advantage of freebsd derivatives is not clear to me.
I am still of the opinion that the best approach is an alternate installer for GUI users. If there were a community alternate installer that would be interesting. <...>
This seems to strike a good balance between not doing anything and keeping things the way they are; and creating a distinct FreeBSD spin a la "FreeBSD Kommunity Edition."

A Live CD or USB version of FreeBSD with a GUI installer? Since this is in the context of KDE Plasma specifically, it could default to creating an X11 installation with x11/kde5 preinstalled and configured. Still just FreeBSD, but with some additional packages and services enabled out of the box. A default /etc/rc.conf with dbus and sddm enabled, maybe cupsd as well?

It's easy enough to turn off anything you don't want, as well as uninstall any applications you don't use, but if creating a good first impression is part of the purpose, having more than you need where everything already "just works" may be better than finding something that doesn't work or doesn't exist, and then go off searching for what you need to go install and configure before your system behaves the way you want it to. That helps perpetuate the "FreeBSD on the server, Linux on the desktop" mentality that holds wider desktop adoption back.

All of this is just talk coming from me though. While I've spent some time thinking about this in the past, and I would like to see something like this happen, I've not made the jump towards actually doing anything about it myself. 🤷‍♂️

But a default GUI system based on FreeBSD already exists and is maintained, GhostBSD.

It's not KDE Plasma though. ;)
I wish FreeBSD upgrade their package servers they are painfully slow even OpenBSD and NetBSD has faster package download speeds !
GhostBSD has better pkg download speeds.