Missing packages on DVD

R

RangaM

Hello, Nice to Meet All and Happy New Year.

I am going to use the FreeBsd for the open source ERP systems, so for that i am testing the FreeBSD. I am interested in the usage of GUI mode in every aspect than command line. I installed the FreeBsd 14 on Oracle VM (i5 3rd Gen CPU, 8 Gb Ram System). After several attempts i got some acquaintance with the FreeBsd and got more idea for installation and running the OS.

I installed the FreeBsd using v.14 DVD. I choose the DVD because of all packages are at one place and need not go or connect to internet for the required packages. The GNOME is installed and worked without any problems. But the interface is not much liked because i came from the MS windows environment. The Kde is much like MS Windows so i liked the Kde interface and installed the Kde on the VM. After several attempts i succeeded. The steps are given here:

i) Installled the bare OS and created a normal user and assigned the user for the groups wheel, video, operator.

ii) Restarted the system and mounted the DVD to install other packages.
# mkdir /dist
# mount -r -t cd9660 /dev/cd0 /dist
# export REPOS_DIR=/dist/packages/repos
# pkg bootstrap --yes
# pkg install xorg kde5 consolekit2 drm-kmod

# sysrc kld_list="i915kms"
# sysrc dbus_enable="YES"

iii) Restarted the system to be login to the Kde interface. But i am getting only the command prompt instead of graphical login manager. As stated in step ii above, i am not installed the sddm and plasma5-sddm-kcm packages, because these two packages are not available from the source DVD. So i omitted from installation.
I tried sddm, xdm and lightdm to be installed from DVD, but those packages are not there in the source.

iv) So, rebooted the system and installed the sddm from connecting to internet.
# pkg install sddm
# sysrc sddm_enable="YES"

v) Rebooted the system and i am able to login with sddm graphical environment and there is no problem for using the kde GUI programes.
vi) I also tried the v.13.2 also and encountered the same problem. ( there is no sddm package).

Required: I tried to manually add the sddm and other packages to the base DVD (Using ultra ISO software), but the modified source DVD gives the error and not booting . The screen shot also given here.

Why the sddm packages are not there in the DVD?
Is there any way to add the additional packages to the source DVD?

Thank u all.
 

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The DVD only contains a selection of packages due to space constraints. Just hookup the system to the internet and install from the package repositories. The packages on the DVD are old any way. They're created when the release is made and are never updated.

This contains everything necessary to install the base FreeBSD operating system, the documentation, debugging distribution sets, and a small set of pre-built packages aimed at getting a graphical workstation up and running.
Click to expand...
 
SirDice said:
… The packages on the DVD are old any way. They're created when the release is made and are never updated.
Click to expand...

The packages are probably from the same date/week as the release. I assume that they're from quarterly (not latest), I haven't checked.

Re: updated packages, FWIW I should never expect an interim DVD e.g. between 14.0 and 14.1. Release engineering resources better spent on other things, IMHO.

HTH
 
SirDice said:
The packages on the DVD are old any way. They're created when the release is made and are never updated.
Click to expand...
grahamperrin said:
The packages are probably from the same date/week as the release. I assume that they're from quarterly (not latest), I haven't checked.
Click to expand...

At least sometimes there's a separate temporary repo that $dvd/packages/* is built from, but I've no details to hand.

But yes; at release time they do constitute a cohesive set of packages that are most likely to work together.

Sure they'll need updating later, and adding to from quarterly or latest as desired, but the idea of a DVD(s) to be able to install a system OFFLINE still applies to many parts of the world with little to no reliable bandwidth, including parts of the "First World" like outback Australia, hospitals, refuges, etc ...

Sadly developers are often the least equipped to comprehend needs of people lacking the fast and cheap bandwidth they routinely enjoy, but thanks to a legacy from people like Rod Grimes and Jordan Hubbard, we still have these facilities.

grahamperrin said:
Technical point of reference: release(7). dvdrom under MAKEFILE_TARGETS, and so on.

<https://github.com/freebsd/freebsd-src/blob/releng/14.0/release/scripts/pkg-stage.sh#L13-L35> for the releng/14.0 branch. The absence of x11/sddm is slightly surprising
Click to expand...

What's included in the meta-port x11/kde5 would be down to the KDE folks, not to release engineering - who as you point out have enough on their plate.

Please see
https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/...n-the-desktop-space.89155/page-10#post-635978
where I had a burst of energy to expound on this topic a tad.
 
RangaM said:
I installed the FreeBsd using v.14 DVD.
Click to expand...

Could you please supply the exact size in bytes of:

...dvd1.iso.xz
...dvd1.iso

There's lots more on 14 than 12 and 13, and I wonder about limits - such as msdosfs 4GiB filesize limit on USB sticks for transport.
 
I'd like to point out that even Windows has a "Windows Store" or "Microsoft Store" repo where you get apps like Skype, Paint3D, and the like. Granted, that's Win11. But same idea as what FreeBSD has been doing all along - just have a few simple utilities in base install, and if you want stuff beyond the basics, you connect to the Internet and go to the repo.

When it comes to specific package selection (what's included in the install ISO, what's not), everybody has an opinion on what that should be like. But long debates on THAT are getting to be pointless. Just pick what you like from an official remote repo, and be done with it.
 
Hi, thanks all.
The size of FreeBsd v.14 is 4.22 GB (4,541,104,128 bytes). (asked by smithi)
The point is to install the software fully from the DVD which is offered as base system. The DVD providing the KDE and GNOME environments as off shelf option to install. Only the sddm package is missing from the DVD to run the Kde. The installation of Kde is ok, but to run fully graphical the sddm is needed and that package missing from DVD.
My point is that, you (FreeBsd community ) providing this great OS for the needed persons, so look into this simple problem (sorry if i wrong).
 
RangaM said:
… The installation of Kde is ok, but to run fully graphical the sddm is needed …
Click to expand...

Not exactly true; SDDM is not a requirement.

I do agree that SDDM should be added. I have set wheels in motion, partly with reference to this June 2023 post by Nate Graham:

pointieststick.com

This week in KDE: SDDM

This week SDDM–the venerable login manager used by KDE and some other DEs–finally got a new release after two and a half years! This work was pushed through by a variety of KDE contribu…
pointieststick.com pointieststick.com
 
RangaM said:
The point is to install the software fully from the DVD which is offered as base system. The DVD providing the KDE and GNOME environments as off shelf option to install.
Click to expand...

You've done well getting as far as you have; you only needed to add one small package from the net.

RangaM said:
Only the sddm package is missing from the DVD to run the Kde. The installation of Kde is ok, but to run fully graphical the sddm is needed and that package missing from DVD.
Click to expand...

grahamperrin said:
I do agree that SDDM should be added. I have set wheels in motion,
Click to expand...

It just needs adding to the x11/kde5 'meta port' list for FreeBSD (if that differs from the Linux setup), hopefully before 14.1

Upcoming 13.3 also, but that first needs 14's pkg-stage.sh merging to 13-STABLE, no?

Sing out if/when there's a PR and I'll try to contribute.
 
Yes of course, i installed sddm package from inter net and run the kde without any problem. But if that (sddm) also included in the DVD there is no need to connect the internet and the installation will be done at once without going from here to there etc.
Also please consider including other display managers like xdm, lightdm in the DVD.
Thank you.
 
grahamperrin said:
Not exactly true; SDDM is not a requirement.

I do agree that SDDM should be added. I have set wheels in motion, partly with reference to this June 2023 post by Nate Graham:

pointieststick.com

This week in KDE: SDDM

This week SDDM–the venerable login manager used by KDE and some other DEs–finally got a new release after two and a half years! This work was pushed through by a variety of KDE contribu…
pointieststick.com pointieststick.com
Click to expand...
If the sddm is not required to run kde, what else we have to run the kde? Any other packages to install from DVD to run graphical login session?
 
RangaM said:
Yes of course, i installed sddm package from inter net and run the kde without any problem. But if that (sddm) also included in the DVD there is no need to connect the internet and the installation will be done at once without going from here to there etc.
Also please consider including other display managers like xdm, lightdm in the DVD.
Thank you.
Click to expand...
What's the problem with connecting to the Internet for installing a missing package? 😲

BTW, if x11/xdm is not in the install DVD image, I'd be surprised - it's perfectly usable as a login manager for any DE (even KDE). Also, Xorg does have a default window manager (x11-wm/twm), TWM (which stands for Tab Window Manager, so named because you can actually Alt-Tab through the windows).
 
astyle said:
What's the problem with connecting to the Internet for installing a missing package? 😲
Click to expand...

In California, probably very little, even in relatively remote parts. First class "first world", but other circumstances exist:

smithi said:
Sure they'll need updating later, and adding to from quarterly or latest as desired, but the idea of a DVD(s) to be able to install a system OFFLINE still applies to many parts of the world with little to no reliable bandwidth, including parts of the "First World" like outback Australia, hospitals, refuges, etc ...
Click to expand...

In my own case, years in a rural hospital home due to physical illness. Even downloading the 12.3 dvd1.iso.xz required multiple restarts with a good Android FTP client over half a day; fetching all packages online was simply unfeasible.

An iffy (then) 3G connection in Oz is scarcely world's worst conditions. Try it in Gaza, or Nepal, parts of Africa, etc.

astyle said:
BTW, if x11/xdm is not in the install DVD image, I'd be surprised - it's perfectly usable as a login manager for any DE (even KDE).
Click to expand...

Not on 12.x nor 13.1 anyway; I don't have a 14.0 packages list.

astyle said:
Also, Xorg does have a default window manager (x11-wm/twm), TWM (which stands for Tab Window Manager, so named because you can actually Alt-Tab through the windows).
Click to expand...

Yes X11/twm is there. Useful only once to confirm Xorg is actually installed, in my view.
 
RangaM said:
… please consider including other display managers like xdm, lightdm in the DVD. …
Click to expand...

IMHO there's a fairly good case for inclusion of SDDM (the incubation, etc.) however:

SirDice said:
… space constraints. …
Click to expand...

If we now push things close to the limit with inclusion of SDDM, and if there's subsequent enlargement of any port-related file, then there'll be a troublesome decision about what to remove.


I haven't attempted to estimate the space requirement. Some of what's below probably overlaps with dependencies of what's already in the DVD image.

Code: 
% cd x11/sddm
% make pretty-print-run-depends-list
This port requires package(s) "brotli-1.1.0,1 consolekit2-1.2.6_2 dbus-1.14.10_3,1 double-conversion-3.3.0 duktape-lib-2.7.0 expat-2.5.0 fontconfig-2.15.0,1 freetype2-2.13.2 gettext-runtime-0.22.3 glib-2.78.3,2 graphite2-1.3.14 harfbuzz-8.3.0 hicolor-icon-theme-0.17 icu-74.2,1 indexinfo-0.3.1 jpeg-turbo-3.0.1 libICE-1.1.0_2,1 libSM-1.2.3_1,1 libX11-1.8.7,1 libXau-1.0.9 libXaw-1.0.14,2 libXdmcp-1.1.3 libXext-1.3.4,1 libXfixes-6.0.0 libXi-1.8,1 libXmu-1.1.4,1 libXpm-3.5.17 libXrender-0.9.10_2 libXt-1.2.1,1 libdrm-2.4.119,1 libepoll-shim-0.0.20230411 libevdev-1.9.1.20200928 libffi-3.4.4 libgcrypt-1.10.3 libglvnd-1.7.0 libgpg-error-1.47 libgudev-237 libiconv-1.17 libinput-1.24.0_1 liblz4-1.9.4,1 libmtdev-1.1.6_1 libpciaccess-0.17 libudev-devd-0.5.2 libwacom-1.5 libxcb-1.15_1 libxkbcommon-1.6.0_1 libxml2-2.10.4_2 libxslt-1.1.37 mpdecimal-2.5.1 pcre2-10.42 png-1.6.40 polkit-123_1 py310-setuptools-63.1.0_1 py39-evdev-1.6.0 py39-pyudev-0.22.0 py39-six-1.16.0 python310-3.10.13 python39-3.9.18 qt5-core-5.15.12p148 qt5-dbus-5.15.12p148 qt5-declarative-5.15.12p32 qt5-gui-5.15.12p148 qt5-network-5.15.12p148 qt5-sql-5.15.12p148 qt5-widgets-5.15.12p148 readline-8.2.7 vulkan-headers-1.3.274 wayland-1.22.0 xauth-1.1.1 xcb-util-0.4.1,1 xcb-util-image-0.4.1 xcb-util-keysyms-0.4.1 xcb-util-renderutil-0.3.10 xcb-util-wm-0.4.2 xdg-utils-1.1.3_2 xkeyboard-config-2.40_3 xmessage-1.0.5 xorgproto-2023.2 xprop-1.2.6 xset-1.2.5 zstd-1.5.5" to run.
%
 
Besides trying to cram something on, potentially having to push something else out, maybe there's a third option? A dvd2 with only packages? Don't actually know the contents of the release DVD, but if I had to chose between ethernet/wifi drivers/firmware (net/realtek-re-kmod for example) or one or more display managers, I'd pick the drivers. You don't need a display manager to run a desktop. You are more likely going to need one of those drivers.

RangaM said:
Is there any way to add the additional packages to the source DVD?
Click to expand...
It's possible, but requires messing around with the image. It's much easier to chuck all the packages you need on a USB stick and pkg-add(8) them right from the stick. I'd recommend using a FAT32 formatted stick, you can mount this on a "barebone" FreeBSD install.
 
elgrande said:
As regular (non-root) user, create the file ~/.xinitrc with content exec startplasma-x11.
Afterwards execute startx.
Click to expand...
I tried with this method, and running the kde desktop without any problem.
Login with normal user and opened the file
$ ee ~/.xinitrc
and added the line "exec startplasma-x11" at the end of file and then run the command:
$ startx
from the command prompt. But is there any way to automatically start the system in graphical mode.
Thanks
 
grahamperrin said:
IMHO there's a fairly good case for inclusion of SDDM (the incubation, etc.) however:

If we now push things close to the limit with inclusion of SDDM, and if there's subsequent enlargement of any port-related file, then there'll be a troublesome decision about what to remove.
Click to expand...

Most of the linux systems are offering two branches of desktop environments like kde and gnome based DVD's to download. So, here also the FreeBsd moderators may consider the separation of single installation DVD having both kde and Gnome into two installation DVD's for Kde and Gnome separately. Even though i am new to the FreeBsd forum, pls consider the suggestion if it possible.
 
RangaM said:
… separation of single installation DVD having both kde and Gnome into two installation DVD's for Kde and Gnome …
Click to expand...

forums.freebsd.org

Is there a real interest in pushing FreeBSD on the desktop space?

Hi there, this is something that I have never dared to ask... But I couldn't resist anymore... Is there a real interest in pushing FreeBSD on the desktop space? I have the impression the answer is: not really! And perhaps the project is hoping that someone else would bring this chance...
forums.freebsd.org forums.freebsd.org
forums.freebsd.org

2024: The year of desktop FreeBSD?

Yeah, I went there with the title, but don't worry, the reference is both deliberate and self-aware. I'm actually about to write an article about this very subject to a Finnish computer culture magazine, from the viewpoint of a newbie-ish, enthusiast, non-sysadmin, desktop user. When I got my...
forums.freebsd.org forums.freebsd.org

Prepare yourself with a snorkel, mask and flippers:
  • the first of those topics is (already) more than ten pages long :)
  • the second will be a more fruitful place to participate (context: an upcoming computer culture magazine article).
 
smithi said:
Will that MFC update 13 (for coming 13.3) as well as 14?
Click to expand...

I assume a merge to both stable branches,

github.com

GitHub - freebsd/freebsd-src at stable/13

The FreeBSD src tree publish-only repository. Experimenting with 'simple' pull requests.... - GitHub - freebsd/freebsd-src at stable/13
github.com github.com

github.com

GitHub - freebsd/freebsd-src at stable/14

The FreeBSD src tree publish-only repository. Experimenting with 'simple' pull requests.... - GitHub - freebsd/freebsd-src at stable/14
github.com github.com

Whether there'll be a merge to releng/13.3, I can't guess. At the time of writing there's nothing more recent than creation of the branch:

github.com

Commits · freebsd/freebsd-src

The FreeBSD src tree publish-only repository. Experimenting with 'simple' pull requests.... - Commits · freebsd/freebsd-src
github.com github.com

www.freebsd.org

FreeBSD 13.3 Release Information

FreeBSD is an operating system used to power modern servers, desktops, and embedded platforms.
www.freebsd.org www.freebsd.org

As far as I can tell, snapshots at <https://download.freebsd.org/snapshots/ISO-IMAGES/> exclude ⋯-dvd1.⋯ images.

Images do exist at <https://download.freebsd.org/releases/ISO-IMAGES/13.3/>. File size reporting is not human-friendly, I see 5293197312 for FreeBSD-13.3-BETA1-riscv-riscv64-dvd1.iso.
 
grahamperrin said:
I assume a merge to both stable branches,
https://github.com/freebsd/freebsd-src/tree/stable/13
https://github.com/freebsd/freebsd-src/tree/stable/14
Click to expand...

Given what (failed to) happen with 12.{1-4} and 13.{1,2} -RELEASEs, that might not be a safe assumption for 13.3-RELEASE.

grahamperrin said:
Whether there'll be a merge to releng/13.3, I can't guess. At the time of writing there's nothing more recent than creation of the branch:
Click to expand...

I hope you or $omeone will keep an eye on it this time, as BETA1 images are now there. I can't, my phone is nearly full.

grahamperrin said:
Images do exist at <https://download.freebsd.org/releases/ISO-IMAGES/13.3/>. File size reporting is not human-friendly, I see 5293197312 for FreeBSD-13.3-BETA1-riscv-riscv64-dvd1.iso.
Click to expand...

4.93 GiB, but the most common amd64 version:
https://download.freebsd.org/releases/ISO-IMAGES/13.3/FreeBSD-13.3-BETA1-amd64-dvd1.iso
is 4912017408 bytes (4.57 GiB) or 3594220044 bytes (3.35 GiB) as .iso.xz - well below msdosfs limit for memstick transport.

So, given a few days for MFC, could you or maybe? bsdimp check so that 13.3 dvd1 gets gnome, linux_base-c7, up to date graphics/drm-* as well as your SDDM patch?

Or just mount the last mentioned dvd1.iso on say /mnt and check its /mnt/release/scripts/pkg-stage.sh?

Thanks.
 
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