Things that make me go "GRrrrrrr" installing FreeBSD 13.1

As many times drhowarddrfine said the same topics starts again and again.
IMO this is the "war of generation". I am not IT educated but I can compare this debate with my work as researcher (genetics). Everything the same. Older you are less you want changes. But time didn't stop and young people with new ideas are coming but we old one never trust them. But it is not our future, it is future of the young generations.
Good observation - and it is correct that way, because thus the balance is created. Purely conservative, not moving at all, is death. Purely innovative, wildly growing in all directions, is cancer. None of them could support life.
 
fernandel The fundamentals have never changed and text will always trump graphics in the sciences. This is not a question of preferences. It's a question of fundamentals. That will never change.
Yes, fundamentals are more or less the same. Just compare with PCR machine which was popular in my days or now. When we show the students they just laugh. Settings are very important (not just settings) but fundamentals is the same.
 
The other thing to remember is that change for the sake of change without reason is never a good reason to change. Often you hear the phrase applied to GUI ideas that "a picture is worth a thousand words" but that phrase was created and applied to something entirely different than this topic.

Something being new is not necessarily any better because it's new any more than something old is bad because it's old.
 
Good observation - and it is correct that way, because thus the balance is created. Purely conservative, not moving at all, is death. Purely innovative, wildly growing in all directions, is cancer. None of them could support life.
Exactly. The reason older folks are skeptical of the new hotness is that we've seen so much hype come and go, and often had to pick up the pieces when the whiz-bang new thing blew up in midair.

However, the brilliant new thing is there somewhere in the pile of buzz and nonsense. Younger and less experienced people are perfect for looking for it because their opinions haven't been colored by so much disappointment yet.
 
Aah don’t get me started on GNU autotools.
Too late!

GNU autotools does have some considerable advantages to CMake but it is implemented so awkwardly, it barely works on Linux or Hurd either (the two core GNU platforms).

I feel autotools would have worked so much better had GNU not been involved with any of it. I love the concept behind GNU but their technical implementations of anything are always a confused mess.
 
Too late!

GNU autotools does have some considerable advantages to CMake but it is implemented so awkwardly, it barely works on Linux or Hurd either (the two core GNU platforms).

I feel autotools would have worked so much better had GNU not been involved with any of it. I love the concept behind GNU but their technical implementations of anything are always a confused mess.
Here is a parody of GNU autotools (not mine) that – I feel – grabs its essence, at least from a user's perspective:
Code:
for i in /usr/include/*.h; do echo -n "checking for $i ... "; sleep 1; echo "ok"; done
 
kpedersen : Yes, GNU was the best thing that ever happened to software... the main issue I have with GNU autotools in particular (clearly I wanted to moan about this really) is that it seems to be written with the assumption that autotools itself will never malfunction. And that’s way too optimistic. I recently had to write some patches to nasm (the Netwide Assembler) on Linux for a hobby project of mine, and was trying to build my patched nasm on FreeBSD and I had to fix ~15 or so errors related to autotools. I can’t remember if they were errors in nasm’s input to autotools, or errors in the actual scripts generated by autotools but I think it was the latter. I think bash was assumed, not sh, also.
Holger, time for a pull request? “Removed unnecessary cruft”.
 
First, I love the FreeBSD installer. Ever since FreeBSD 5.x, or maybe I should say as far back as I can remember, I've never had to go read how to install FreeBSD. Literally, if you can `dd` an image or use cdrecord you're good. The availability of thumb drives made it even easier.

Also, with a small bit of reading learning how the installer works is remarkably simple:

It uses gpart to create a partition table and create partitions and boot sectors written. geli is then used to encrypt the disks, and either UFS or ZFS is used to build filesystems on the resulting partitions. The root filesystem is mounted in /mnt; chroot into our new root, and the base.txz is extracted into the root. Password is set, users created, additionally src, lib32 support, man pages, and debug symbols can be extracted as well.. and you can drop into the installation to further customize before reboot.

The advantage of it's simplicity is A) its easy to customize and B) you don't actually have to use the installer.

I am not proposing we do this, but I actually think that the freebsd installer could be further simplified to a single screen asking to select disks and a geli key, create partition tables and partions, install base.txz, zfs on geli, and be done.

Back to the OP. I have the same issue with some of the older hardware I support in regards to needing firmware. I solve this problem by mounting the thumbdrive after `dd`ing onto the thumb drive and loading fiirmware and kernel modules onto the thumb drive. It would be nice to include this in the handbook and if I find some time over the holidays, I'll submit a PR.
 
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