Swift 5.5 for FreeBSD.

majortom said:
When you you actually decide that you are interested in Swift, and you learn why it is being used extensively for server side applications by many companies whose services you probably use (like Amazon), I might consider responding to you again.

Until then, good luck and have a great life.
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If that's not an example of being toxic, I don't know what would be. That kind of tone was awfully prevalent from OP.
 
grahamperrin said:
astyle "Thanks" is common courtesy. Etiquette.

A courteous suggestion is not an order.
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I agree with the part about saying "Thanks", but the sentence
majortom said:
I would also suggest going to the Swift Forum and adding a post there to this thread:
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really sounds like a boss telling a clueless subordinate what to do. This might fly in the workplace (depending on the country and industry), but I think that on the forums, that would be a breach of forum etiquette. I think that saying something like "Can I ask you to post this on the Swift forums?" AND providing a link to the thread - that would be much better tone. To top it off, some kind of appreciative follow-up would be good. That's just my opinion here, of course.
edit: Double-checking made me realize that the link was in fact provided.
 
I have posted quotes, basically the whole thing. The person dances around it and makes excuses and backtracks. A lot of it is context.

Just the whole, she wants to see a port, but expresses how she doesn't care what FreeBSD does or how it would port it. Uh, how else would it get ported? If they wanted Apple to exclusively port it, then that person needs to go on that forum. People are telling someone how a port is made, or what it takes, and basically, they get told, I DIDN'T ASK THAT. You didn't ask that, but it's relevant to everything about how a port gets done. If you don't care how something is ported, don't ask people to "express" interest in how it's ported excuse me, it being ported. How it's ported is fundamental to it being ported, whether Apple or a volunteer does it.

This is just plain rude.
majortom said:
I guess Linux it is.
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That's like emotional blackmail.
majortom said:
I have quite a few FreeBSD systems, and never said I would move any of their tasks to Linux.
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grahamperrin said:
With respect: I see otherwise, and I hope that you can eventually see it for yourself.
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Well, you're accusing me. When I at least have respect for the porting process, and don't treat people like I'm making demands. Even if I were paying someone to do something, I don't boss people around or treat them like how the OP is.

They're veiled orders. That's why they're veiled.

majortom said:
I just find it funny, that not one person who has responded to this thread has expressed interest in using Swift on FreeBSD (the actual question being asked), but all have tried to explain why someone else should spend energy on maintaining it.
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Yet, this same person shows a bossy tone.


majortom said:
Glad you are looking out for my career future. If I was worried about this from a CV standpoint, learning to use Linux, the dominant OS and Cloud hosting platform, would be way more valuable than being the maintainer of an open source port on FreeBSD.
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majortom said:
However, it seems clear that there is no interest from this community. Great that people are super excited about explaining process and their their lack of interest in the product though.
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majortom said:
I asked a question if there was interest in Swift on FreeBSD. I did not ask a question about how I could become the maintainer of a port, how ports get done
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majortom said:
That was not the question I asked. Again, lots of great explanations about the ports process, and none expressing interest in Swift on FreeBSD.
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majortom said:
If you are not interested in Swift on FreeBSD, why do you think it adds value to this thread to respond on topics not asked?
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majortom said:
Not once did I ever suggest that anyone in this community should do anything other than express interest or lack there of in using Swift on FreeBSD. Not one single response to my post responded to the question I asked.

Not one.
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majortom said:
That was not the question I asked. Again, lots of great explanations about the ports process, and none expressing interest in Swift on FreeBSD.
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majortom said:
My original post asked a question "Is there interest?", and made some observations about the current state. I did not complain about anything. If you are not interested in Swift on FreeBSD, why do you think it adds value to this thread to respond on topics not asked?
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majortom said:
Instead, I got people lecturing me on how the ports process here works, complaining that I was selfish for asking others to do a port, valuable career advice (from people with no knowledge of me at all), someone who pronounces what Apple will or will not do (with no evidence or support of his statement), and two people who specifically are not interested in having it happen (one who explained that even if it did happen it would have no value because it would be so incomplete that one would not be able to use it anyway).

All super helpful.
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A few more quotes: https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/swift-5-5-for-freebsd.82225/post-534003

There's hypocrisy too. I keep saying, the porting process matters, then someone keeps slamming, that they didn't ask about the porting process and doesn't care. Without a porting process, a port doesn't happen.
 
sidetone said:
This whole thread is bullshit.
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To be honest, I agree... and yet we all keep posting to it. I guess it's some kind of psychological pull - instead of simply getting up to have a beer, or even ignoring it completely, we keep beating this horse.
 
I wish the person would show respect to the porting process, and this would stop.

"I would also suggest going to the Swift Forum and adding a post there to this thread." I think that one's ok.
 
astyle said:
clueless subordinate
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Your words, not his hers, and your words are inflammatory.

etiquette
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Etiquette often begins with respect to an opening post. Proper reading thereof.

If there's a question, focus on answering the opening poster's question.

Ignorance and going off-topic are poor etiquette.

sidetone said:
I wish … this would stop.
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You're perpetuating. The Unwatch button exists.

sidetone said:
That's like emotional blackmail.
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This conveniently ignores the emotion that came first.

The opening post, which was hugely disrespected.

The opening post, which showed love for FreeBSD:

majortom said:
I have several Server Side Swift applications that I would love to host on my own systems, but without a FreeBSD port, I am stuck adding Linux boxes for them.
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Considering how something gets ported has everything to do with how something gets ported, telling lots of people, I didn't ask how it gets ported is disrespectful. Yet, the person ultimately wants it ported.

Telling people the unwatch button exists? What's that?
 
From the first sentence of the opening post:

majortom said:
Swift, someone ported it to FreeBSD.
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sidetone said:
Without a porting process, a port doesn't happen.
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This mistreats the opening poster as if they were a clueless subordinate. It's inflammatory.

astyle said:
clueless subordinate
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sidetone said:
Telling people the unwatch button exists? What's that?
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Don't feign confusion.

Your psychological expertise and textual analysis skills should have triggered a sense of you being mistreated as if you're clueless.

There.

Now.

How do you feel? Mistreated? Inflamed?
 
Um no. This is 100% fact. Again.
sidetone said:
Considering how something gets ported has everything to do with how something gets ported, telling lots of people, I didn't ask how it gets ported is disrespectful.
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I can't speak for astyle 's quote, but it was self-explanatory he was describing someone's behavior.

grahamperrin said:
Your psychological expertise and textual analysis skills should have triggered a sense of you being mistreated as if you're clueless.
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So, you admit you're being a jerk. If that hadn't happened, I could say, you're a jerk, and you would deny as the next person.

BTW, it wasn't confusion. I was hinting on out how asinine it was.
 
What does that have to do with this? That was his perception that he thought you were making an assumption. I didn't see someone saying, that you said some words. It looked to me like one person wanted to see results, and expecting someone else to keep pace with an expectation.

I argued with him before, but I didn't hold onto a grudge. I've said what I thought another time, and that was it.

I'm irritated at this thread. Again, telling someone about the porting process isn't disrespectful, that has to do with how it gets ported. Telling everyone, "I didn't ask how it gets ported," but you want it ported.
 
sidetone said:
I'm irritated at this thread.
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This is far from FreeBSD Forums at its best.

sidetone please consider the possibility that some of what you write is objectionable, adding to the irritation. The greater the irritation, the greater the likelihood of you receiving asinine responses.

astyle said:
… we keep beating this horse. …
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There's an occasionally ugly side to FreeBSD Forums, with an occasionally self-congratulatory attitude from the minority who create or exacerbate the ugliness.

We have an opportunity to address a troublesome set of behaviours, and I'm in no mood to be delicate with indelicate troublemakers who find shared amusement in the end result.

These troubles are off-topic from expressions of interest in Swift 5.5 for FreeBSD, but I'll not be blamed for the early derailing of this topic. Here we are.
 
I've repeatedly clearly said what the problem is, and you keep defending it. And this drama got dragged out.

When someone mentions a program on FreeBSD, in order to use it, it must be ported. That's what they want, for it to be ported. When the topic of porting comes up, I think, "how would it get ported." Getting the continued response, "I didn't ask how it would get ported," is annoying. Or saying, is there a reason, why it's no longer ported, then saying, I didn't ask about why it's not there anymore. It would require a porter. If the person wants Apple to exclusively port it, and doesn't care about the porting process, then Apple would be the place to ask. If you ask here, it means the porting process, and a volunteer. And with that attitude, why should anyone do anything for someone who doesn't respect the porting process. They may anyway, but oh well.

Could a thread occur without this?
 
sidetone said:
I've repeatedly clearly said what the problem is,
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Your contribution to this topic began with what I saw as an unnecessary mis-characterisation and ignorance of the opening post.

You continue to mis-characterise.

Such things are problematic.

… this drama …
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– which you dramatised, when, instead, you could have done something better.

If you don't want drama, don't add to it.
 
I am new here. I apologise if I said something wrong that made matters worse. I love FreeBSD and I love Swift too. I replied to the OP with my honest wish that Swift would get ported and I went to the links he provided only because I truly want it ported. I didn't feel forced to do it at all nor did I feel being bossed around whatsoever. But reading on the thread I understood that we (as in the FreeBSD comunity) can also participate and work for this wish to materialize. I even thought how I could help. But I have to be honest I was afraid to reply anymore as I didn't understand why there was so much fight going on and I was scared to make things even worse by saying anything else. Please, don't fight. We all love FreeBSD. Maybe we can all start over and understand each other and work towards the common goal of seing this beautiful operating system thrive - maybe with a nicely maintained Swift :)
Thank you all for keeping this amazing project.
 
intini said:
Answering the OP question: Yes! I would love to see Swift ported and maintained on FreeBSD. I like the language very much and it would be wonderful to see it running on our favorite OS. Of course, it would be even greater to see also some sort of GUI library for it.
I went to GitHub and asked there too.
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If you have not yet seen it, Swift by Sundell is a great site for learning about Swift, as is TheSwiftDev.com. John Sundell has a great Swift Static Site generator that is really easy to use, while in contrast, Tibor ( the author from TheSwiftDev) has been developing Feather, a Swift-based CMS. Check them both out on Github (both have lots of interesting repos).
 
majortom said:
If you have not yet seen it, Swift by Sundell is a great site for learning about Swift, as is TheSwiftDev.com. John Sundell has a great Swift Static Site generator that is really easy to use, while in contrast, Tibor ( the author from TheSwiftDev) has been developing Feather, a Swift-based CMS. Check them both out on Github (both have lots of interesting repos).
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Thank you! I will check it out indeed!
 
Followed the link and made a post, will see what (if anything comes of it).

It is probably worth stating that I did not feel pressured in the least. Maybe we New Yorkers are just thick skinned, but I found the original posts on this thread and the infighting that followed rather amusing.
 
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