reddit vs discord

[astyle]

What Charlie_ says (not in so many words) is following that link doesn't bring up the content you are linking to, the user is always redirected to a login page:

View attachment 18662

Apparently one must be registered and logged in to see the content.

Something wrong with that?

Just log in, and read the message. This is standard practice in real world, get used to that. There's plenty of places that use 'secure messaging platforms' to communicate with clients, like banks, hospitals, law firms, and the like. People are not expected to be logged into those 'secure messaging platforms' 24/7. They get an email with a link that says, "You have a message from us, please login and check", and that's it. Yeah, sounds almost like scam - unless you actually know that this is the system the bank/hospital/law firm actually uses, and this is how they communicate. Yep, an instance where legit outfits took ideas from crooks and put it to good use.

You might be interested in reading this journal article on paywalls:

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/1461670X.2019.1633946

Of course, it is behind a research journal paywall. Perhaps you aren't interested enough whats contributed there?

I believe meine showed a pretty simple workaround recently, although I haven't played with that yet.

 

[PMc]

Discord has a paywall; just you pay with your data and adverts rather than money directly.

Precisely put, in such case you are not the paying customer. Instead, you are the product being sold to their advertisers.

 

[kpedersen]

Charlie_ please, don't delay, make your way to post 650128 to proclaim that Bugzilla for FreeBSD is useless. Don't forget to add a screenshot.

Since when did you need an account to read FreeBSD's Bugzilla?

 

[Cath O'Deray]

And another thing!! Double exclamation mark I must complain, in the strongest possible terms, about open access to articles such as this:

How dare they make a PDF freely available. What must I do to put it behind a paywall? I'll not be satisfied until there's something more to complain about.

 

[PMc]

Just log in, and read the message.

Elaborate, please. What is the login?

As far as I understand, you get a login only after agreeing to a contract diminishing your personal rights.

This is standard practice in real world, get used to that.

If I remember correctly, it it not the first time being standard practice in America to buy and sell people for profit.

 

[Cath O'Deray]

Will this corporate slavery never end? I pay my taxes, and this, this is what it's come to. Open access, payment not required.

Won't somebody please think of the children?

 

[astyle]

Elaborate, please. What is the login?

As far as I understand, you get a login only after agreeing to a contract diminishing your personal rights.


If I remember correctly, it it not the first time being standard practice in America to buy and sell people for profit.

Just get used to it, because EVERYBODY worth their salt is doing it anyway. About 10 years ago, someone I know a surgery at a major hospital - and needed to stay in touch for some follow-up. That hospital had a patient portal for that. If they tried to do the surgery at a hospital that does NOT have a patient portal - good luck even finding one to do that specific surgery, on this entire planet. And no, the patient is not gonna be logged into that portal 24/7.

 

[kpedersen]

Will this corporate slavery never end? I pay my taxes, and this, this is what it's come to. Open access, payment not required.

Thats the pre-release draft released 18 months later. Kind of like the very expensive C standard can be purchased or you can download the free pre-release.

Read it:

Unpublished version – accepted for publication in Journalism Studies

[...]

It may contain minor differences from the journal's pdf version.

Do you actually know what a paywall is? I am beginning to suspect you don't.

Go back to the original link you were provided and you should see something like this:

This vs the Discord login is really no different. Sleazy crap.

Edit: ... unless, in future can you link to "open access" versions of Discord communication? Is there perhaps an archive (this is common for mailing lists and IRC)? Now that would probably be better received on these forums and would likely have a better lifespan so loads of dead links aren't littered everywhere. Surely it is possible?

 

[astyle]

Will this corporate slavery never end? I pay my taxes, and this, this is what it's come to. Open access, payment not required.

View attachment 18664

Won't somebody please think of the children?

ok, let's all meet in some seedy pub in New York, have a few drinks, and scream out our grievances about how difficult it is to explore and hang out on the great US Army invention called Internet ?

 

[PMc]

Just get used to it, because EVERYBODY worth their salt is doing it anyway. About 10 years ago, someone I know a surgery at a major hospital - and needed to stay in touch for some follow-up. That hospital had a patient portal for that. If they tried to do the surgery at a hospital that does NOT have a patient portal - good luck even finding one to do that specific surgery, on this entire planet. And no, the patient is not gonna be logged into that portal 24/7.

Irrelevant. The patient is certainly not required to have any internet access, as not everybody can afford that.

 

[astyle]

Irrelevant. The patient is certainly not required to have any internet access, as not everybody can afford that.

THAT is irrelevant - even a homeless person can go to a public library and log into a patient portal from there. I've helped people do that, so I'd know how that works.

 

[PMc]

THAT is irrelevant - even a homeless person can go to a public library and log into a patient portal from there. I've helped people do that, so I'd know how that works.

Good to know. That's not yet going to happen here, and I would find it quite grotesque e.g. forcing an elderly who can not even really walk to somehow travel to the next city to access a library (speaking from experience, my mom is 93 and got a replacement joint last year)
I think we soon need an initiative preserving the rights of those who desire to stay away from this techology. It was meant as an optional enhancement, not as a means to subdue people.

 

[shkhln]

Is there perhaps an archive (this is common for mailing lists and IRC)?

Archives are extremely uncommon for IRC.

 

[msplsh]

Screenshots were provided. If Charlie_ was truly interested in Discord, in what's contributed there, he could have contacted Discord for help with gaining access.

This is the antithesis of the open web particularly for a thing such as support which is why he keeps on posting it. It seems like you don't think this is important by mocking the posts.

make your way to post 650128 to proclaim that Bugzilla for FreeBSD is useless

This is disingenuous as what you've probably linked is a security related bug which would be restricted for policy reasons, not support.

 

[astyle]

Good to know. That's not yet going to happen here, and I would find it quite grotesque e.g. forcing an elderly who can not even really walk to somehow travel to the next city to access a library (speaking from experience, my mom is 93 and got a replacement joint last year)
I think we soon need an initiative preserving the rights of those who desire to stay away from this techology. It was meant as an optional enhancement, not as a means to subdue people.

Uhhh... within US, Internet is actually considered a utility, on par with electricity, gas and water. And based on that idea, there are actually programs to reduce cost of access, even to the point of giving free smartphones (well, cheapest possible new models, though) to the homeless people. Participation, though, is voluntary - if you can't understand how that benefits you, it's your loss.

Yeah, that did result in homeless people in Manhattan congregating around coffee shops, libraries, etc., and surfing for porn in public. ? Other than that, the access to Internet did improve overall for that segment of the population. No, tiny screens are not the most convenient thing to use to fill out paperwork that asks for help with things like money, employment, etc. But it's still something.

But man, you live so far out you don't even have a library or another place with public Internet access??? Well, you're the one who gets to decide whether that's worthwhile or not, this is not for anyone to judge.

 

[kpedersen]

Archives are extremely uncommon for IRC.

Really? Even something simple like this:

Index of /2024/04/02

I thought most large projects had an IRC bot logged into the room that kept logs.

 

[PMc]

Uhhh... within US, Internet is actually considered a utility, on par with electricity, gas and water.

Yeah. John Brunner, 'The Shockwave Rider'

And based on that idea, there are actually programs to reduce cost of access, even to the point of giving free smartphones (well, cheapest possible new models, though) to the homeless people. Participation, though, is voluntary - if you can't understand how that benefits you, it's your loss.

It benefits the authorities. Instead of doing the work they are supposed to do, idem, in a democratic society, to serve the public, they just install some broken web-app, getting bakschisch from the developing shop on the way, and some very overpriced bill for the taxpayer.

Yeah, that did result in homeless people in Manhattan congregating around coffee shops, libraries, etc., and surfing for porn in public. ? Other than that, the access to Internet did improve overall for that segment of the population. No, tiny screens are not the most convenient thing to use to fill out paperwork that asks for help with things like money, employment, etc. But it's still something.

But man, you live so far out you don't even have a library or another place with public Internet access???

A library? In a 600 people village?

Well, you're the one who gets to decide whether that's worthwhile or not, this is not for anyone to judge.

When I travelled east Asia, there are coffeehops everywhere (and that was 20 years ago). But here, I haven't seen any - probably there are some in the immigrant's ghettos. Otherwise people are supposed to buy their own gear - but basically they don't need it. Nowadays having a new smartphone has become an insignia of status, mainly among the underdogs. Obviousely you can't do much useful things with such a gadget, except watch advertisements and buy useless stuff. So that's probably the whole point in it all.

There are complaints that the government needs to do more for "digiization" - but then, as a matter of fact everything works well without, so the question must be asked: who wants that "digitization" so eagerly and for what benefit?
If the benefit ist just to force people so they cannot do without any longer, then that is not a benefit, it's the opposite.

Also, I for my part have an understanding of responsibility, and that includes technological impact assessment. So if there is a new technology, which is not actually needed by ordinary people (because everything worked without before), but is complicated and involves new risks, then it is definitely wrong to force people to use it.

 

[astyle]

Yeah. John Brunner, 'The Shockwave Rider'

Nope, an actual proclamation from DC's federal agencies. It became law not that long ago, and gives Uncle Sam domestic power to regulate ISPs so that access prices are not completely out of control. And yes, wording is important here.

It benefits the authorities. Instead of doing the work they are supposed to do, idem, in a democratic society, to serve the public, they just install some broken web-app, getting bakschisch from the developing shop on the way, and some very overpriced bill for the taxpayer.

Well, it can be argued that smartphones for the homeless is like putting lipstick on a pig. The vast majority of them would not know to treat it as a lifeline. Those few who do know how to treat it as a lifeline - they would be poster children for that assistance program.

 

[PMc]

Nope, an actual proclamation from DC's federal agencies.

That's what I mean. They try to live science-fiction, not realizing that it was actually meant as a dystopia.

Well, it can be argued that smartphones for the homeless is like putting lipstick on a pig.

It's probably cheaper than to solve the actual problem.

 

[astyle]

That's what I mean. They try to live science-fiction, not realizing that it was actually meant as a dystopia.

Funny, I take advantage of that law, and yes, pay less than what I would have if the law were not in effect.

 

[gotnull]

Really? Even something simple like this:

Index of /2024/04/02

I thought most large projects had an IRC bot logged into the room that kept logs.

IllumOS have that, it's well designed and looks modern.
1) you can also select the date like you would do with the mailing list.
2) on top there is an option where you can clean the screen by removing the useless messages "enter/left the room", the reading looks better that way.
3) dark/light theme
https://log.omnios.org/illumos

Could be nice to have that too on FreeBSD.

 

[shkhln]

Really? Even something simple like this:

Index of /2024/04/02

I thought most large projects had an IRC bot logged into the room that kept logs.

You don't need to feign surprise. For example, Libera Chat specifically advertises "no logs" as part of their privacy policy. Which means it's up to to the users to set up logging and since users are lazy enough to use a third party server in the first place that is unlikely to be done. None of the channels at https://wiki.freebsd.org/IRC/Channels have any kind of message archive.

 

[PMc]

Funny, I take advantage of that law, and yes, pay less than what I would have if the law were not in effect.

Doesn't need a law for that. In all supermarkets here people pay less when they have a smartphone.
That's because the supermarket wants to track them, analyse what they buy, when they buy it, how they react on the advertisements sent to them, etc.etc. And to make people agree to that, there are always special offers for those with a smartphone - or the other way round, products are overpriced for those without.

 

[kpedersen]

Which means it's up to to the users to set up logging and since users are lazy enough to use a third party server in the first place that is unlikely to be done. None of the channels at https://wiki.freebsd.org/IRC/Channels have any kind of message archive.

I suspect it is more common than you might think. They just don't particularly make a big thing of it. Many IRC project channels already have bots in place to "reserve" the room. It is not too much of a push to also get it to do logging.

Even some of the smaller Linux projects like Alpine have them or GUIX/guile too. I was interested if the OpenBSD project had one. They do but it looks fairly "independent"

(A fun project could be to extend a bot to misuse GitHub as a dumping ground for the logs; committing every 5 mins or so upon conversation.)

 

[astyle]

Doesn't need a law for that. In all supermarkets here people pay less when they have a smartphone.

US law keeps prices artificially low for utilities. Those are regulated. If they were not, electricity costs would be out of control. Without the law, and given the inflation, prices for Internet access could easily be triple or quadruple what they are now in the US.

And US was the first out with the idea of paying less in grocery stores when you have a smartphone. I try to NOT participate, even as grocers/advertisers keep sweetening the deal. Groceries and clothes are not considered a utility expense in the US. At some point, I will be asking myself how much I care that somebody else can figure out why I prefer Hawaiian pineapples over the ones from Costa Rica. I'm gonna say to the entire Internet (at least the ones that care to read this): It's because Hawaiian pineapples are sweeter, moron marketers.

Those two are separate things. Don't conflate them.