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A Call for FreeBSD Artwork

oliverh

Aspiring Daemon

Thanks: 38
Messages: 557

zeiz said:
IMO that's what exactly should be dropped (horns, hoofs...).
FreeBSD is very serious OS with great future.
Logo must be relevant and for sure shall not be cartoon/comics alike.
In general any great logo is never a picture but rather sketch, symbol and the simpler the better.
To keep succession with current logo I propose to leave only the TRIDENT.
What is trident? It's a power. It's exactly about FreeBSD.
Well, there is nothing wrong with Chuck, apart from some Christian fundamentalists who cannot cope with the difference between demon and daemon. Last not least the trident symbolizes a software daemon's forking of processes. Easy, isn't it? If a fat penguin can rule the world, including major companies, then there should be also a place for a daemon and his fork. It's a mark for several decades of quality :)
 

fonz

Son of Beastie

Thanks: 368
Messages: 2,560

oliverh said:
Well, there is nothing wrong with Chuck, apart from some Christian fundamentalists
[snip]
If a fat penguin can rule the world
Isn't gluttony a sin? That would invalidate the whole point those religious zealots could be making...

Alphons (hands off beastie I say)
 

kpedersen

Daemon

Thanks: 327
Messages: 1,142

I do believe that branding images should be made avaliable for FreeBSD for those who want it (like me) especially for desktop. Unfortunately I simply don't really know what to suggest.

OpenBSD (sorry :p) has done really well by giving their logo a really cartoony feel. I do tend to believe that FreeBSD really doesnt know in which direction to go for their artwork.

Perhaps our friendly daemon could be redrawn in vector like Darwin's Hexley mascot. That way it would be easier for people who know how to do art, to create proper themed images etc...

Could be worse... we could just have a boring old flag :D (sorry NetBSD :p)
 

zeiz

Aspiring Daemon

Thanks: 56
Messages: 691

@oliverh: Why Christian fundamentalists? Do Islamic ones have no reasons for critics? Sikh people? Jewish? Buddhists...no, not sure they care. I also don't care. Mostly because here is wrong place for religious speculations.

Well, neither Tux nor Chuck rule the world. Not yet. But both currently carry the same message in background: homemade stuff.
That's what wrong with Chuck and Tux.
FreeBSD is unique and the only in the world, it's a brand and it deserves better logo than 3 table pub in Amsterdam.
Once great people adopted Chuck only to quickly run back to work. They didn't care and FreeBSD quality wouldn't be affected by a smiling pink crocodile instead of imp with fork. By now they created great product and now they care. That's why they called for better artwork.
Trident is the essence of FreeBSD, not a table fork, but Trident. And fortunately it was already on the logo! Who gets the power? U! User, not an imp, a fish or a hippo from comics.
 

paean

Active Member

Thanks: 10
Messages: 111

zeiz said:
IMO that's what exactly should be dropped (horns, hoofs...).
FreeBSD is very serious OS with great future.
Logo must be relevant and for sure shall not be cartoon/comics alike.
In general any great logo is never a picture but rather sketch, symbol and the simpler the better.
To keep succession with current logo I propose to leave only the TRIDENT.
What is trident? It's a power. It's exactly about FreeBSD.
I agree that the logo should be simplified. The trident is focused and suggestive, unlike the NetBSD logo which conveys a message of mediocrity.

kpedersen said:
OpenBSD (sorry :p) has done really well by giving their logo a really cartoony feel. I do tend to believe that FreeBSD really doesnt know in which direction to go for their artwork.
Indeed, the OpenBSD folks seem to understand something about branding. Personally, I'd like to see Beastie retired.

FreeBSD does not need an directionless logo that says "'daemon' is almost spelled like 'demon', aren't we clever?".

Instead it needs a sharply focused brand that doesn't detract away from its goals. What are the top three priorities of the FBSD Project? If they are speed, stability and scalability, then the branding should suggest that. If its something else, then make it that.

Before any more images are posted, it would make more sense to nail down what the logo should convey. I would think the images should stem from that.
 

oliverh

Aspiring Daemon

Thanks: 38
Messages: 557

@zeiz

Well as Roman Catholic atheist, I first refer to the people which surround me. Furthermore the mentioned religions don't have such a strong picture of this very devil, especially not drawn like this. Christian imprint is e.g. a know fact in countries like the USA, do you need examples? But in the end, I really don't care about any religion, as long as they don't interfere with the real world (politics and so on).

>By now they created great product and now they care.

Sorry that's utter nonsense. BSD was a great and huge product in the past (since the 70s), even with a commercial success (BSD/OS). Today it's still great, but a mere insider tip than well-known product. Reality first, fandom last.


>Well, neither Tux nor Chuck rule the world. Not yet.

I seems you don't know what you're talking about. Linux "rules" the world in terms of media and servers - that's also a fact. It's a pity, but it's a fact. Forget the desktop, the desktop is ruled by Microsoft and some 3-4% by Apple, then maybe 1% Linux and that's it!

>Once great people adopted Chuck only to quickly run back to work.

Please stop it! Chuck was the mascot for BSD a well known _branch_ of UNIX in the past and base for many more commercial UNIX operating systems.The original Daemon is from 1976, the 2nd version from 1984. BSD btw. was born at the university not at work like Windows.

http://www.mckusick.com/beastie/jpg/foglio.jpg
http://www.frbsd.org/img/42bsd_p1.jpg
http://www.frbsd.org/img/43bsd.jpg
http://diablotin.info/livres/couver...ementation_of_the_4.4BSD_Operating_System.gif

As you can see, it's a mascot made by intelligent people. And 99% percent of FreeBSD users and developers are happy to see Chuck even today as mascot. The official logo btw. is this silly jumping-ball with two handles.

Today we've got a silly FreeBSD logo, a rather boring NetBSD logo and an inspiring OpenBSD logo. We've got huge companies with Tux in their brochures and they don't have any problem with it.

A nice reading btw.:

http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-advocacy/2005-February/001669.html

I submit that they have it on their heads. Rather than us changing,why don't the people with the problem simply stop using beastie in their OWN marketing materials to their hyper-sensitive customers,and find some sanitized image they can be happy with. Maybe even a picture of John Ashcroft's head - I hear he's available these days, maybe he will pose for you.
 

oliverh

Aspiring Daemon

Thanks: 38
Messages: 557

paean said:
I agree that the logo should be simplified. The trident is focused and suggestive, unlike the NetBSD logo which conveys a message of mediocrity.



Indeed, the OpenBSD folks seem to understand something about branding. Personally, I'd like to see Beastie retired.

FreeBSD does not need an directionless logo that says "'daemon' is almost spelled like 'demon', aren't we clever?".

Instead it needs a sharply focused brand that doesn't detract away from its goals. What are the top three priorities of the FBSD Project? If they are speed, stability and scalability, then the branding should suggest that. If its something else, then make it that.

Before any more images are posted, it would make more sense to nail down what the logo should convey. I would think the images should stem from that.

http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-advocacy/2005-February/001669.html

I submit that they have it on their heads. Rather than us changing,why don't the people with the problem simply stop using beastie in their OWN marketing materials to their hyper-sensitive customers,and find some sanitized image they can be happy with. Maybe even a picture of John Ashcroft's head - I hear he's available these days, maybe he will pose for you.
Open source is different, it's no corporate bullcrap, it's free and mostly driven by _idealism_.
 

paean

Active Member

Thanks: 10
Messages: 111

Very theatrical, but when you remove the drama there's little substance. Sort of like some of Castro's speeches. ( ;

That said it's very likely the emotional attachment to the old logo will hinder a new one. It's another reason I agreed that the trident would be suitable. It hints at the history of Beastie while not desperately sucking at nostalgia's teat.

oliverh said:
Open source is different, it's no corporate bullcrap, it's free and mostly driven by _idealism_.
Interesting comment. Please expand. How would Beastie reflect idealism over a new logo? Branding is done the same way by charities as it is for multi-billion dollar companies: PURPOSEFULLY.
 

fonz

Son of Beastie

Thanks: 368
Messages: 2,560

oliverh said:
as Roman Catholic atheist
Please to be explainink that one, da? :p

oliverh said:
Christian imprint is e.g. a know fact in countries like the USA
[snip]
I really don't care about any religion, as long as they don't interfere with the real world (politics and so on).
Well put. Except that it's really not just the U.S.A., it's more like half the b****y world.

oliverh said:
Chuck was the mascot for BSD a well known _branch_ of UNIX in the past and base for many more commercial UNIX operating systems.The original Daemon is from 1976, the 2nd version from 1984.
[snip]
As you can see, it's a mascot made by intelligent people. And 99% percent of FreeBSD users and developers are happy to see Chuck even today as mascot.
I agree. Chuck is an integral part of the history of almost every variety of BSD-style UNIX and there's nothing evil or Satanical about him period. If anything, I think Chuck has done more good than harm. Several people were drawn to BSD out of curiosity, because they liked the cool little demon[sic] thingy and wanted to know what he was about. I think that's worth more than the nonsense of a few intellectually-challenged zealots to whom finding stuff to complain about seems to be the sole purpose of life, the universe and everything.

oliverh said:
The official logo btw. is this silly jumping-ball with two handles.
I wouldn't go as far as calling the current logo silly and I can understand that it's probably more convenient from a design point of view, but I'd still prefer Beastie over something that looks like it could have been designed by Paul Teutul Jr. ;)

Alphons

P.S. There was an amusing anecdote in Greg Lehey's excellent book "The Complete FreeBSD" (I don't know if it's still actively being maintained so it may be somewhat outdated but when I got it I found it extremely useful). The story can also be found here.
 

zeiz

Aspiring Daemon

Thanks: 56
Messages: 691

oliverh said:
@zeiz
Well as Roman Catholic atheist
Atheism is just another religion also based on a belief. So it must have its own fundamentalists...just to discharge religious voltage :)
oliverh said:
BSD was a great and huge product in the past (since the 70s), even with a commercial success (BSD/OS). Today it's still great, but a mere insider tip than well-known product.
Bingo! That's what we are trying to do: turn FreeBSD into well known product! To be such a logo and a name are extremely important though it's just $0.02 of contribution but it's magical one. Anybody is judged first by his costume, his appearance, his body language. Tons of samples when a quite worthless person achieves a lot only because of right appearance. And vice versa we dislike sometimes somebody because of his appearance, we reject him, we are not interested and we'd never know that it was Aesop. FreeBSD needs a promotion so it needs winning logo and winning trademark to successfully enter the promotion.
oliverh said:
As you can see, it's a mascot made by intelligent people. And 99% percent of FreeBSD users and developers are happy to see Chuck even today as mascot. The official logo btw. is this silly jumping-ball with two handles.
People could be intelligent in something and show luck of skills in something else, it's quite common. The "ball" is such a classic sample. It's wrong vision of the essence. I've never seen Chuck without the trident. Why so? Because without the trident he is just a cat or monkey. Face, head (bust:)) indeed represent a human, essence represents a daemon. That's why on this picture the falling one (on the left) shows us only his a.. but his trident is still there! :e
No need to handpick the mascot from 99% of current users who would hopefully become 0.01% of future users. And it's impossible to take it off our devs. Both devs and current users are skilled enough to create their own walls, splashes etc. You love it? You have it! But for others it's only immature image of mature OS.
paean said:
That said it's very likely the emotional attachment to the old logo will hinder a new one. It's another reason I agreed that the trident would be suitable. It hints at the history of Beastie while not desperately sucking at nostalgia's teat.
That's right. Emotions never lead to success. Even in a theater if we are talking about an actor's career.
Let's get rid of such egoistic point of view, let's stop thinking about ourselves but rather think about FreeBSD and its future. I have strong feeling that "devil issue" has been pulled by ears to...keep the image. Many great projects has begun at uni by talented "teenagers" still inspired by Halloween, nihilism and strong willing to be different. Devils, ghosts, monsters...now plus robots, aliens...such stuff traditionally and successfully serve childhood. But kids grow and become adults. Eventually their symbols supposed to grow too. Times also matters. Let's imagine somebody hanging a banner from 50th on his Manhattan store nowadays.
Once more and finally: I am not about the imp and devilry in general. As I wrote if it would be a kinda Bugs Bunny or Sponge Bob or somebody's famous face I would write the same, namely poor logo implementation. Science and Art are on different poles of human's mentality. Nobody is talented in everything with exception of a very few "Da'Vinci". In reality everybody does his part of job. Thus Art must be done by Artist. We can only generate ideas for a professional designer.
Chuck served for years and like a loving father he's giving us such an idea, he leaves us his heritage that is already great opportunity: instead of creating something from scratch (times demand) we have a choice to inherit Chuck's essence as his simple, elegant, powerful and memorable trident.
 

mudskipper

New Member

Thanks: 1
Messages: 16

Hi f-andrey, Sorry: my fault. I thought the images were embedded in the svg, but they are not. You will need these two:

logo_left.png
logo_right.png

Easiest solution for now will be to open the svg in a text editor, and replace the (two) instances of
Code:
xlink:href="/usr/data/afbeeldingen/FreeBSD/logo_left.png"
sodipodi:absref="/usr/data/afbeeldingen/FreeBSD/logo_left.png"
to your local path. The same applies for the `logo_right.png' path in the end.

The svg may need some cleanup too :)
 
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