Why are FreeBSD users seen as black sheep? (+ thanks)

If the corporations were just working on it for their own professional use, that wouldn't be so bad; they tend to do minimal work, avoid redundant or breaking changes and just fix issues. IBM's AIX is a fairly good example of this.

Its the fact that some companies are trying to turn it into this strange consumer product for completely non-technical users which a) will never work and b) is damaging to the workflow of technical users.

Systemd is a result of this. Easier hookup with GUI tooling, making it easier to non-tech users at the expense of compromising the scriptyness of it for those who can script administrative related requirements.

(Btw, likely calling it systemd/Linux is what made them squirm and become mean. They don't like to be reminded of this takeover).
 
Ok, but, uh, those scriptyness benefits were weighed against everything else and they "lost" in the sense that most people stuck with distros that adopted it and didn't switch to OpenRC or anything else.
 
msplsh said:
Ok, but, uh, those scriptyness benefits were weighed against everything else and they "lost" in the sense that most people stuck with distros that adopted it and didn't switch to OpenRC or anything else.
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Indeed. Though a lot of people did weigh it up and change distros. Some distros like Devuan were even invented to avoid the breakage. BSDs also got a big boost to user-base.

The bigger issue is that diverging from common software (i.e Debian, Red Hat) creates a whole new level of problems. This doesn't in any way suggest that systemd *isn't* a problem. It simply highlights a bigger problem with Linux in general in that you are essentially pulled along by the nose by random people with random, weird ideas.

If you had to choose between chopping off an arm or chopping off a toe... You would likely go for the toe right? That doesn't mean the choice is "good". Losing scriptyness benefits was also not "good" but it outweighs being a hermit or using FreeBSD apparently.
 
kpedersen said:
diverging from common software (i.e Debian, Red Hat) creates a whole new level of problems
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This is exactly what the linux people are revolting against when the OP brought up FreeBSD. Similar, but different enough to cause "problems."

You're being "pulled along by the nose" by FreeBSD leadership, it's just that people don't notice because they're going the same way so there's no tension on the rope. 🤷‍♀️ Pkgbase put some tension on it for some people.
 
msplsh said:
You're being "pulled along by the nose" by FreeBSD leadership, it's just that people don't notice because they're going the same way so there's no tension on the rope. 🤷‍♀️ Pkgbase put some tension on it for some people.
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Very true. Though the direction of the leadership is to remain UNIX-like. With GNU and Linux this has only ever been a symptom of its legacy, rather than a direction. Big, tangled and heavy has always been the GNU way.

Plus BSD leadership isn't random people. Its a meritocracy. Whereas all the little projects that make up Linux, really is random people. And if the one that happens to develop i.e fdisk wants it to be in glorious technicolor and Klingon to be the default language, they just commit and push those changes. Its up to them.

I do foresee PkgBase is going to be a problem. But thankfully, that is *one* problem. With Linux, it is so, so many. Almost every thing duct taped to it is a ticking timebomb because there is no real leadership, goal or direction. Just us nerds hacking on what is fun at the time and then glued together under the name "distro".

I'm not knocking it though. This is why Linux is perfect for super-computers and throw-away web servers. Just like ultra-fast prototype aircraft, the MTTF of most of its components is around 4 hours rendering systemd vs openrc kinda moot ;)
 
drhowarddrfine said:
I'm at the point where I don't care. Neither should you. They have their opinion and have points that are probably correct but you have your opinions which are true, too. Those who try and tear you down for your opinions without giving solid reasons for their opposing view are not worth listening to.
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The closer I get to "retirement" the fewer opinions I care about. My dogs, my wife, the butcher that is cutting me a 4lb boneless ribeye roast from the big end: those I care about. The rest of humanity? Not so much.
 
All operating systems are shit today. You just need to pick the shit that smells best to you. Arguing about operating systems with people you dont know is total waste of time.
 
a lot of people believe their personal preferences are equivalent to morality and if you don't like the same things they do, you're a bad person. this explains a lot about many people's behavior.
 
atax1a said:
a lot of people believe their personal preferences are equivalent to morality and if you don't like the same things they do, you're a bad person. this explains a lot about many people's behavior.
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Exactly that. But the worst kind are Linux/FreeBSD users that make fun of people that use Windows. Followed by Linux users that argue about different Linux distributions. I understand they want to feel superior by bashing other people, but common...
 
Funny, I've been a FreeBSD daily driver for a long time, wife uses Windows, I make fun of myself because I have to go through 27 different GUIs to figure out the IP address her machine go assigned.

Honestly arguing over "my OS is bigger than yours" or "My OS's dad can beat up your dad" is pretty stupid. Why? It's about the applications. "Do the applications that I NEED run on this OS? Are they stable? Then cool, I don't care about the OS I care about the application.

This thread has been entertaining, but OP issue was response from another forum and then coming here and asking "why don't they like us".
So fun, but like when a cop pulls you over and asks "Do you know why I pulled you over?" the only right answer is "No, do I look like Zelda the mind reader?"
 
atax1a said:
a lot of people believe their personal preferences are equivalent to morality and if you don't like the same things they do, you're a bad person.
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Which then extends to making up "facts" that supposedly support their preferences. Which is just as bad here as elsewhere.

MrBSD said:
But the worst kind are ...
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... FreeBSD users on this forum who are vicious about Linux, Windows, MacOS, and whatever else. Often with made-up arguments, or based on their political or near-religious convictions. Why do I consider them the worst? Because I get to see them. I don't participate in Linux/Windows/... forums, so I don't see the other kinds.

I use MacOS, Linux and FreeBSD, for various purposes. I have used Windows intensely before, and I wouldn't get terribly upset going back to it if the need arises. They all have advantages and downsides.
 
mer said:
"Do you know why I pulled you over?" the only right answer is "No, do I look like Zelda the mind reader?"
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Probably a better answer than the few canned ones I give:
"No, but if *you* don't, I say we let the suspense build a bit longer."
"Probably not because 'you wanted a hug.'"
"No but the fact that you have to ask that makes me concerned that I may have far larger problem, than 'why', very soon."
 
mer said:
So fun, but like when a cop pulls you over and asks "Do you know why I pulled you over?" the only right answer is "No, do I look like Zelda the mind reader?"
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This is a cheap trick to get you to incriminate yourself. I would answer thusly: "Officer, I'm going to respectfully decline to answer any questions." This is a good answer in the US. Not sure about other countries.
 
Jose said:
This is a cheap trick to get you to incriminate yourself. I would answer thusly: "Officer, I'm going to respectfully decline to answer any questions." This is a good answer in the US. Not sure about other countries.
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That's what I said, mine was with zero respect ;). I understand their phrasing and have politely said "I no idea. Can you tell me why?" which at least in the US flips it back on them "sorry you need to articulate a reason".
 
Jose said:
This is a cheap trick to get you to incriminate yourself. I would answer thusly: "Officer, I'm going to respectfully decline to answer any questions." This is a good answer in the US. Not sure about other countries.
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Strong agree. No answer you can give will help you. For example, in the case of speed:

1) You say you were knowingly speeding = bad
2) You say that you had no idea what speed you were going, thus not in control of the vehicle = bad
3) You state you were within the road limits, thus lying = bad

You will very likely still get a ticket as the base punishment but if they push any of those above answers when prosecuting, it could actually be more than a ticket!
 
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