What do you think about a "SteamBSD" machine ?

The Steam machine is expensive. in my head the SteamBSD machine should costs the half of its price. And I want a dedicated hardware for FreeBSD.
That's a commendable wish. And even when many great projects started with wishes and dreams, to realize them a solid project planning and product development based on solid "tedious boring" engineering is mandatory. Otherwise it just stays a dream, perhaps with money lost. To realize things reality must be faced.

Low prices come from four points:
  • Most reduced bare minimum hardware just sufficient enough to deliver the needed performance as tightly as possible. For that you first need to know exactly what the software needs you wanna run on it, and what can spared. Anything not really needed cost money, so increases the price. Rule of thumb: 1€ production cost comes to 10€ selling price. In negotiations about mass production they haggle not about single cents, but about tenths of a cent, since for each 100k pieces every cent more cost 1k€. Having a cent here, another one there, while dealing with margins around 2...6% those quickly add up to signifcant sums. On the other hand everything needed not contained drops the performance, which results in unsatisfied customers, which means bad rewiews, which means massive drop of sales. So it doesn't matter if you use AI. You need to optimize the software - the system that your game console is in its core - anyway, to reduce hardware requirements to the max. I already also told you, particulary with games you need best performance always. Players do not tolerate laggy gaming. Vibe coding does not deliver optimized software. So you have to do a lot of work on the software on your own anyway. Unless you have this, it makes no sense to look for hardware - because you don't know what exactly you need, until you get your software finished. AI can help you on producing parts of it, but it cannot do it all. It can neither prevent you from optimizing, nor to do it in the right order, and above all it's no guarentee you can completely neglect the software in a project that's 99% software and rely on it will deliver the best solution possible fitting the hardware you've chosen. You first have to make games run on FreeBSD. Then see how to optimize that. Then see what hardware is sufficient enough. Then see what it cost. And be ready to face the fact, you cannot beat Steam's price. I don't know if it's possible at all, but it's always a possibility one must always keep in account with every project to eventually realize the original set target cannot be reached. That's exactly why in every real project there always is a lot of analysing and evaluation before even planning starts, and above all before any money is spent. Of course a Ferrari is expensive, and it would be nice to get one for half the price. But is it possible to realise the same for half the price? You may get a car as fast, but not so luxurious. or you can get the luxury, but a much slower car then. Looking for the hardware first is like trying to bake a cake by filling the dough into the baking mold after you removed it from the oven. Saying, 'I don't need to care about the recipe, I'm using an instant baking mix' does not change the fact you're doing it in the wrong order. Creating a computer cost less than Steam's one ain't no art. Creating a computer cost less and providing the same performance is. Imagine you create some hardware that's cheaper as Steam's but not provides even remotely the performance. Then you tell your customers, 'Well, you cannot play the recent 3D open world on it, but Tetris and Pac-Man just run fine.' Guess how many are frantic to get one of your gaming consoles then? That's right: None.
  • Low production cost. Which means production in countries with low wages, which means China, or India. They always want to be payed in full in advance for the whole lot charge ordered. As long as the money ain't full on their bank account, they don't start any production at all. This was exactly the point somebody always knowing it all better than the rest of the world underestimated when he promised a smartphone to buy for 100$ each produced in homeland. First finding out producing it at home will make his thing cost thousands of dollars, and then after broken his promise and eventually produced in China anyway like all the others he before accused for betrayal, still the promised price cannot be kept. Ideas, wishes, intensions, believes, and hopes are by far not enough. In business good connections, experience, and negotiating skills, which means exemplary social skills are the most important deciding factors. Ignorance, arrogance, mouthbreathing and threatening are neither of that, nor helping the case at all.
  • Low margin. The more margin, the higher the price. If you wanna sell a lot - and you have to (see point below) you have to reduce your margin to a very low percentage (think one-digit) - you have to deal with shops and supermarkets. Those are going to receive the most margin, if they even include your product into their assortment and sell it for you. Even Amazon wants his share, and selling on Amazon alone ain't enough if nobody knows you have a product to sell.
  • Large production numbers per lot charge is the most important factor to lower the price. Not thousands, think at least hundred thousands - in a single lot charge ordered each. If you are no millionaire willing to risk your fortune, you need to convince an investor. Convincing an investor takes a ready for market developed product, and a market analysis showing enough numbers can be sold for sure. Having an investor then means you are not the boss anymore. Investors don't waste money. They wanna get their money back sooner as you thought with as much revenue as possible. The investor will tell you how things are going to work from now on, what to do when, which schedules to meet etc. (Things like gaming consoles must be placed into shops before christmas sale starts, better on Black Friday - don't you think this means production can start in late October then.) Don't be surprised if the investor brings some other guys first helping than replacing you, and telling you, this will not become a FreeBSD based gaming console anymore, but from now on you're going to build a Windows based plant watering device. Of course, you can go to one of those crowd funding platforms. But even there unless you don't already have a product mature for series production and market release, but just some tinkered prototype or some fancy idea, only, you will not gather the money needed to get into series production, but need to deal even more with impatient buyers instead of working on it, since only morons invest their money into dreams. Additionally yours were neither the first, nor the last crowdfunding project which hopelessly underestimated the cost to start a real series production, and completely overseen and forgotten all the approvals, admissions, licenses, according procedures and tests needed, to be allowed to sell legally products on consumer markets in Europe, Northamerica, Southamerica, Asia, Africa...not respected the differences in laws individual countries, or in the USA even single states have...
That's what I meant with:

I don't want to disencourage you.
But it's always better to check first, if a target is realistic to be reached, before one starts running blindly into an endless desert and getting lost.
And the larger and unkown the desert, the better on checks more carefully before and plan ahead.
 
I don't want to disencourage you.

More or less :

Component Model Price €

CPU = Ryzen 5 8600G ; price = 185 €
Motherboard = B650 entry (ASRock/MSI) ; price = 130 €
RAM = 16 GB DDR5-6000 CL30 (2×8) ; price = 55 €
SSD = 1 TB NVMe PCIe 4.0 ; price = 65 €
PSU = 550 W 80+ Bronze ; price = 60 €
Case = Mid-tower ATX, 2 ; price = 55 €
NIC = Intel i210 PCIe gigabit ; price = 20 €
GPU = Radeon rx 6600 ; price = 150 €

Total = ~700 €

With this :


we are at 900/1000 euros. Cheaper than a Steam Machine :)
 
More or less :

Component Model Price €

CPU = Ryzen 5 8600G ; price = 185 €
Motherboard = B650 entry (ASRock/MSI) ; price = 130 €
RAM = 16 GB DDR5-6000 CL30 (2×8) ; price = 55 €
SSD = 1 TB NVMe PCIe 4.0 ; price = 65 €
PSU = 550 W 80+ Bronze ; price = 60 €
Case = Mid-tower ATX, 2 ; price = 55 €
NIC = Intel i210 PCIe gigabit ; price = 20 €
GPU = Radeon rx 6600 ; price = 150 €

Total = ~700 €

With this :


we are at 900/1000 euros. Cheaper than a Steam Machine :)
Where are you finding RAM and SSD for those prices? In the USA, 16GB of DDR5 RAM is going for about $250, and the cheapest 1TB SATA SSD's are going for about $120.
 
Where are you finding RAM and SSD for those prices? In the USA, 16GB of DDR5 RAM is going for about $250, and the cheapest 1TB SATA SSD's are going for about $120.
Most likely that listing was done with an llm that didn't take into account that ram and ssd prices get multiplied by 4 times already.
Here a real listing:
ASRock B650M-H ; 114.95 euros
AMD Ryzen 5 8600G ; 199.95 euros
Cooler Master MWE Bronze 750W v3; 69.95 euros;
Kingsman Gaming DDR5 Master 16Go ; 269.95 euros;
Patriot SSD P400 Lite 1To; 189.95 euros;
Fractal Design Node 304; 99.95 euros;

So a total of 944.70 euros.
If we add a RX 9060 Xt to that, it will be:
Gigabyte Radeon RX 9060 XT; 659.95 euros
So a grand total of 1604.65 euros

We can also add a rx 7600 instead
Gigabyte Radeon RX 7600; 379.95 euros
So a total of 1324.65 euros
 
Where are you finding RAM and SSD for those prices? In the USA, 16GB of DDR5 RAM is going for about $250, and the cheapest 1TB SATA SSD's are going for about $120.

I set lower prices because I thought I could find the goods at lower costs by using "package forwarding" ; "assisted purchase" or "concierge shopping" services.

The basic assumption is that maybe there are markets somewhere in the world that still offer lower prices.
 
Good try kinda warm. it's Hajduk Split

"Kinda warm" is a gentle, optimistic euphemism for a total miss. 😂

mk48.jpg
 
we are at 900/1000 euros. Cheaper than a Steam Machine :)
That might be the problem with pre-builds: I wouldn't buy that with that mobo or CPU :p

What's the most demanding game on Steam FreeBSD can run? It doesn't make sense to have all that power and not be able to use it, and I'd argue a limited gaming machine doesn't need the most expensive latest-and-greatest hardware (locks out lower-budget, or who might be more likely to run FreeBSD vs buying a $3k Alienware with Windows and installing Steam; there's a price point between building yourself vs pre-build with warranty and gamers nowadays like ease)
 
None of this makes any sense, you need to suspend your belief, like watching a movie premise.
My man here wants to vibe operating systems and roll out computers faster and cheaper than OEMs on top of hardware order backlogs with millions of $ in pending orders.

Sit back and enjoy the ride

Nothing of what YOU think or say makes sense; I have to suspend MY disbelief—like accepting the premise of a movie—a movie that's playing inside YOUR head. I think you have a serious problem: either you don’t read what I say, or you struggle to understand it. Neither I nor any sane person would want to compete with the giants. We’re just here discussing the minimum hardware configuration needed to run a handful of games on FreeBSD using the Linuxulator—which is being patched—to gauge the effort required to increase the game count. It’s about determining whether that effort is worth it, especially considering the cost of the SteamBSD machine's hardware. We’re just reasoning here; we aren’t spending a dime upfront or trying to compete with anyone. You’ve got a whole scenario playing out in your head, simply because YOU can’t stand me— just because I want to use "vibe coding".

In any case, your presence in this thread also sabotages the fun I would otherwise generate. Because even if it were true that I’m just making things up in my head, your annoying way of interjecting shatters the suspension of disbelief I create in others.
 
Nothing of what YOU think or say makes sense; I have to suspend MY disbelief—like accepting the premise of a movie—a movie that's playing inside YOUR head. I think you have a serious problem: either you don’t read what I say, or you struggle to understand it. Neither I nor any sane person would want to compete with the giants. We’re just here discussing the minimum hardware configuration needed to run a handful of games on FreeBSD using the Linuxulator—which is being patched—to gauge the effort required to increase the game count.
If you just wanna play games under FreeBSD, like many others already do including myself, then you don't need to build a gaming console for it. If needed just pimp up one of the computers you have to provide the power needed.
But by your own words, you don't play yourself. Which for me already is a contradiction. I don't see why a no-player wants to create a gaming console when there are so many other possible projects wanted/needed in FreeBSD world could be better done instead in my eyes, above all way less comprehensive and less complex projects. Apart from that I doubt if you then can judge if games running satisfyingly. But of course this is my very own point of view and my very personal opinion, and you are free to decide for yourself, of course. But you asked for opinions, so you get it.
This is a free world, FreeBSD is free, and I am the last one trying to stop free ideas. Don't get me wrong: If at all I'm trying to prevent people from doing things which in my eyes were mistakes, or trying to give some input to get to something useful instead of ending in desaster, but I'm not going to stop anybody. Who am I to do so? If I knew it all better than everybody else, I would run for president.

All I grasp is by what you said you like the challenge to build something. That's per se very commendable and even perhaps you may not really feel it, but this forum's community is very supportive in such things. Because that's the least thing all in the FreeBSD community share: The interest in creating things.
But support does not mean, doing it for you. You decided to use AI to do most of the work for you. OK. Then just do it, and see how far you get.
And support ends when somebody is unwilling to accept it.
You don't have to accept others' advices. Of course not. But you must accept you have no right to demand support. So don't come here presenting some shit an AI chatbot barfed out, and ask others to review and correct it for you. Because that's contradiciting your very own core idea of this project exactly: That this can be done without any expertise in software development and project engineering at all, but all it needs can and will be provided by AI chatbots.
Either way it's your very own responsibility. You have your own ideas how things can get done, and you wanna make you own experiences. Well, OK then. Do it!
If you are so damn sure about what you are going to do, then just do it! Who's stopping you?
First thing you are going to learn is what I already told you twice: It doesn't matter if you start by using the hardware you already possess or first buy and build a new computer. Neither way changes the fact that the real job is to first get games running under FreeBSD at all. Then to get some ambitious games running. Then to see how make them run smoothly. Then to see how to get as many games running as possible. Then to see how to create a way to automate and simplify that process, so other users can play games of their choice by simple mouse clicks instead of tinkering themselves. Then you have something even remotely could be called a gaming console.
Just assemble some FreeBSD compatible hardware and place it infront of people, 'Here, a FreeBSD gaming console!' simply will not do. This will become a FreeBSD computer. Since most users either buy and use laptops, or like myself, assemble their own computers, there is only few need to create such. The difference between a gaming console and a computer is, it's very easy to run games on it. So, you have to install several recent, popular 3D games, and you have to play them a while to see if they really run smoothly. That's what engineers call a verification test.
If you are convinced you first need to buy the right hardware, and then the main job of getting Steam games running under FreeBSD is easy and can simply be done by doing what some AI chatbot delivers, well, then just buy the stuff first and do it then! Who is stopping you?
So, for the start get at least one of the following games run under FreeBSD at all: "Assassin's Creed Black Flag Resynced", "Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 4", "Battlefield 6", "Cyberpunk 2077: Phantom Liberty", "Grand Theft Auto VI" or pick some other similar recent 3D game.
You wanna create a gaming console? A gaming console must be capabale to play such recent if not exactly those games totally smoothly and absolutely lag free! Anything else is unacceptable. Best test was to let kids play with it and ask them, if they are satisfied.
You said, it's simple and easy, because AI will provide anything you need.
Several others told you this will not work this way. You are convinced it will. And you wanna do your own experiences.
So just do it!
Present result!
I'm waiting impatiently to see any.
⚫
⚫
🟢
GO!
 
I think you have a serious problem: either you don’t read what I say, or you struggle to understand it. Neither I nor any sane person would want to compete with the giants. We’re just here discussing the minimum hardware configuration needed to run a handful of games on FreeBSD using the Linuxulator—which is being patched—to gauge the effort required to increase the game count. It’s about determining whether that effort is worth it, especially considering the cost of the SteamBSD machine's hardware. We’re just reasoning here; we aren’t spending a dime upfront or trying to compete with anyone. You’ve got a whole scenario playing out in your head, simply because YOU can’t stand me— just because I want to use "vibe coding".
Are we? My schizophrenia might be getting worse, then...
I'm planning to build the first SteamBSD machine of the world. I will heavily modify the Linuxulator to make it perfectly compatible with 100+ Steam games. When this job will be completed,I will start thinking about which kind of dedicated hardware will be necessary to host the SteamBSD os. Isn't this nice ?
I already have my own ideas and a strategic plan already written of 1400 pages. The point is that it is very important to compare your ideas with those of other users.
I’ll have had fun, learned a lot, and built something interesting and useful that I’ll use for my own enjoyment (assuming I will manage to do it)... while you’ll be left with nothing....

In any case, your presence in this thread also sabotages the fun I would otherwise generate. [...] I don't know if you've noticed, but I dismantle everything you say as if it were a toy.
Please go on, it's quite fun indeed.
 
If you just wanna play games under FreeBSD, like many others already do including myself, then you don't need to build a gaming console for it. If needed just pimp up one of the computers you have to provide the power needed.
But by your own words, you don't play yourself. Which for me already is a contradiction. I don't see why a no-player wants to create a gaming console when there are so many other possible projects wanted/needed in FreeBSD world could be better done instead in my eyes, above all way less comprehensive and less complex projects. Apart from that I doubt if you then can judge if games running satisfyingly. But of course this is my very own point of view and my very personal opinion, and you are free to decide for yourself, of course. But you asked for opinions, so you get it.
This is a free world, FreeBSD is free, and I am the last one trying to stop free ideas. Don't get me wrong: If at all I'm trying to prevent people from doing things which in my eyes were mistakes, or trying to give some input to get to something useful instead of ending in desaster, but I'm not going to stop anybody. Who am I to do so? If I knew it all better than everybody else, I would run for president.

All I grasp is by what you said you like the challenge to build something. That's per se very commendable and even perhaps you may not really feel it, but this forum's community is very supportive in such things. Because that's the least thing all in the FreeBSD community share: The interest in creating things.
But support does not mean, doing it for you. You decided to use AI to do most of the work for you. OK. Then just do it, and see how far you get.
And support ends when somebody is unwilling to accept it.
You don't have to accept others' advices. Of course not. But you must accept you have no right to demand support. So don't come here presenting some shit an AI chatbot barfed out, and ask others to review and correct it for you. Because that's contradiciting your very own core idea of this project exactly: That this can be done without any expertise in software development and project engineering at all, but all it needs can and will be provided by AI chatbots.
Either way it's your very own responsibility. You have your own ideas how things can get done, and you wanna make you own experiences. Well, OK then. Do it!
If you are so damn sure about what you are going to do, then just do it! Who's stopping you?
First thing you are going to learn is what I already told you twice: It doesn't matter if you start by using the hardware you already possess or first buy and build a new computer. Neither way changes the fact that the real job is to first get games running under FreeBSD at all. Then to get some ambitious games running. Then to see how make them run smoothly. Then to see how to get as many games running as possible. Then to see how to create a way to automate and simplify that process, so other users can play games of their choice by simple mouse clicks instead of tinkering themselves. Then you have something even remotely could be called a gaming console.
Just assemble some FreeBSD compatible hardware and place it infront of people, 'Here, a FreeBSD gaming console!' simply will not do. This will become a FreeBSD computer. Since most users either buy and use laptops, or like myself, assemble their own computers, there is only few need to create such. The difference between a gaming console and a computer is, it's very easy to run games on it. So, you have to install several recent, popular 3D games, and you have to play them a while to see if they really run smoothly. That's what engineers call a verifaction test.
If you are convinced you first need to buy the right hardware, and then the main job of getting Steam games running under FreeBSD is easy and can simply be done by doing what some AI chatbot delivers, well, then just buy the stuff first and do it then! Who is stopping you?
So, for the start get at least one of the following games run under FreeBSD at all: "Assassin's Creed Black Flag Resynced", "Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 4", "Battlefield 6", "Cyberpunk 2077: Phantom Liberty", "Grand Theft Auto VI" or pick some other similar recent 3D game.
You wanna create a gaming console? A gaming console must be capabale to play such recent if not exactly those games totally smoothly and absolutely lag free! Anything else is unacceptable. Best test was to let kids play with it and ask them, if they are satisfied.
You said, it's simple and easy, because AI will provide anything you need.
Several others told you this will not work this way. You are convinced it will. And you wanna do your own experiences.
So just do it!
Present result!
I'm waiting impatiently to see any.
⚫
⚫
🟢
GO!

yeah,I don't play games,but I'm a geek and I like to to tinker with something. The Linuxulator can be like a drug. Trying to patch it and achieving the desired result—a game that actually runs—brings the same satisfaction a mouse feels when, after wandering aimlessly through a maze, it finally reaches the spot where the piece of cheese is waiting and the appetite grows with eating.
 
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