upgrade old FreeBSD home server

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Todd McComb

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So please let me clarify, a PCIe 4 might not work, or I simply won't get full performance?
 

diizzy

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People have reported instability with the USB subsystem (random disconnects) related to PCIe 4.0 and AMD have released BIOS patches for it however it doesn't seem to be the proper fix for everyone. Keep in mind that X570 also have worse SATA performance B550 in some cases.
 
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Todd McComb

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So maybe B550 then....

What about the 2.5G ethernet issue? If that is a problem, does it fall back to 1G well enough?

I ask these questions because what is available & on sale now, etc....

USB I don't use much, so I don't know if I care. Presumably stability will increase with time, i.e. new OS versions?

Or maybe I need to keep looking at older motherboards....
 
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Todd McComb

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So that link is telling me the 2.5G ethernet is now supported?

I'm not accustomed to reading those pages. To what version of FreeBSD does that refer?
 

diizzy

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It's patch that needs a review (preferably) to be committed to the tree (-HEAD branch) and may be backported to 13-STABLE (not guaranteed).

I would personally take a closer look at:
Asus ROG Strix B550-F / Asus ROG Strix B550-A (color schema seems to be the only difference)
Asus ROG Strix B550-E (3x PCIe 16x slots (all are not 16x however)), Intel WiFi but don't expect support anytime soon
Depending on what kind of requirements regarding expansion you have
These all depend on the 2.5G driver however depending on what revision you get you may need to do some additional work
Ref: https://www.reddit.com/r/intel/comments/k4alab/is_the_i225v_chip_issue_resolved/ (Google if you want more information)
Regarding ECC Asus says this: https://www.asus.com/support/FAQ/1045186/ + specs on product page

Most other B550 boards comes with Realtek LAN which can be a very mixed bag (prepare yourself to get a separate nic)
If you're deadset on 13 or such you might need to get a temporary NIC at least.

Here's a pretty nice summary of all boards:

I wouldn't recommend getting a B450 board unless you're on a very tight budget and I have no idea about ECC support on those boards.
 
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Todd McComb

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But aren't you the same person saying the keyboard might randomly disconnect on a B550 system?
 
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Todd McComb

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And I don't mind getting an extra card to do what I want, just as long as it's supported and there's somewhere to plug it in!
 

gpw928

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If you need PCIe bus (and SATA) capacity, the X570 chipset has a lot more to offer than B550 (which admittedly has 2.5 Gb Ethernet -- but you have to be able to use it).

I now have two X570 motherboards. One runs FreeBSD 12.2 and the other runs Debian 10. They run a variety of legacy PCIe cards (Intel Ethernet, LSI SATA/SAS, ATI and Nvidia video) without issues. However I don't have any PCIe 4.0 cards.
 
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Todd McComb

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Ha ha, I feel like I go in circles! But thank you for the comments.... If getting PCIe 4.0 is not going to be a problem, then that makes sense to me. I do want the possibility of various expansion, so want enough slots.
 

diizzy

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If you need PCIe bus (and SATA) capacity, the X570 chipset has a lot more to offer than B550 (which admittedly has 2.5 Gb Ethernet -- but you have to be able to use it).

I now have two X570 motherboards. One runs FreeBSD 12.2 and the other runs Debian 10. They run a variety of legacy PCIe cards (Intel Ethernet, LSI SATA/SAS, ATI and Nvidia video) without issues. However I don't have any PCIe 4.0 cards.
SATA performance is however quite noticable lower on X570 (appears to be a design issue), chipset fan (in most cases) and you're usually fine with B550 in most cases despite having fewer channels.
 

astyle

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Athlon??? that's an old name... used to be 'crappy server' hardware from AMD back in 1990s, but the name Athlon recently revived by AMD for lower-end chips with integrated graphics.

I'd stay away from newer ROG Strix line - it's overpriced by a pretty fat margin - ROG Strix GPUs are roughly a 30% price premium over Tuf Gaming cards on Amazon.com, and for motherboards, the price disparity on Amazon is even worse - ROG Strix can be 200-300% more expensive than a Prime board with similar specs. A board that takes a Threadripper will drive the price north of $500, easy.

I paid $90 for my B350-Prime back in 2017, and promptly fried it with a crappy $19.99 PSU from Apevia. Fortunately, components attached to the motherboard did not fry, and I became a believer in Asus motherboards. Had to get a replacement B350-Prime, and a $40 EVGA (known good brand) PSU.

I should have invested in a better GPU when they were reasonably cheap back in 2017... my Asus Radeon RX 550 4 GB was around $100 back then - and now a Radeon RX 550 cannot be found on the Internet for less than $250. Gonna wait until next year to build my next rig, I guess...
 

diizzy

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astyle
Please actually look before stating such facts, there's no premium in this case at all since there are no equivalent boards available. See the docs.google link or Asus website for reference
 

astyle

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astyle
Please actually look before stating such facts, there's no premium in this case at all since there are no equivalent boards available. See the docs.google link or Asus website for reference
  1. ROG Strix RX 6900 XT on Amazon: $2,850
  2. Tuf Gaming RX 6900 XT on Amazon: $2,450 --> Otherwise same cards!
  3. Tuf Gaming X570 motherboard, no wifi: $177
  4. Tuf Gaming B550 motherboard, no wifi: $155
  5. ROG Strix X570 motherboard, no wifi: $322
  6. ROG Strix B550 motherboard, no wifi: $178.
Prices picked up in the last 10 minutes of this post. ROG Strix line does command a premium over Tuf Gaming, and I have yet to see why. Most egregious premium is in the x570 motherboard.
 
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Todd McComb

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I'm being told that neither the B550 nor X570 motherboards support using the onboard graphics with Ryzen 3000 CPUs. So I would need a separate graphics card with either chipset. Does that sound right?
 

astyle

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I'm being told that neither the B550 nor X570 motherboards support using the onboard graphics with Ryzen 3000 CPUs. So I would need a separate graphics card with either chipset. Does that sound right?
Not correct. integrated graphics are on the CPU. Some Ryzen 3 chips come with integrated graphics, and the more recent Athlon chips come with integrated graphics. As long as the chip physically fits into an AM4 socket, you're good to go with either B550 or x570 motherboard. I'd recommend B550, though, it's cheaper.
 

diizzy

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  1. ROG Strix RX 6900 XT on Amazon: $2,850
  2. Tuf Gaming RX 6900 XT on Amazon: $2,450 --> Otherwise same cards!
  3. Tuf Gaming X570 motherboard, no wifi: $177
  4. Tuf Gaming B550 motherboard, no wifi: $155
  5. ROG Strix X570 motherboard, no wifi: $322
  6. ROG Strix B550 motherboard, no wifi: $178.
Prices picked up in the last 10 minutes of this post. ROG Strix line does command a premium over Tuf Gaming, and I have yet to see why. Most egregious premium is in the x570 motherboard.

I don't see anyone talking about video cards but perhaps I missed something (ie it's irrelevant) same goes for X570 motherboards (which weren't the discussion).

Now, comparing your two examples which would be the B550 -F model I listed and B550-Plus you're referring to.
TUF lacks a 1x 4-pin power connector, comes with Realtek LAN (instead of Intel on the B550 -F model), slightly worse audio codec
I honestly don't see how ~20$ is a Premium at all given that you get noticably better LAN, slight better power distribution and slightly better audio codec
 

diizzy

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I'm being told that neither the B550 nor X570 motherboards support using the onboard graphics with Ryzen 3000 CPUs. So I would need a separate graphics card with either chipset. Does that sound right?
AMDs marketing division had a bit of fun when naming their CPUs, Ryzen CPUs ending with G have integrated graphics and "all" motherboards supports integrated graphics.
If you'd want a Ryzen 3000 (Zen 2) CPU with graphics you'd need ot look at 4000-series. 3000G-series would be Zen+ ie Ryzen 2000-series)

 
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Todd McComb

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So I was also told I'd need a 3000 series CPU, that 4000 wouldn't work with FreeBSD. And it looks like 3000G series don't do ECC? I guess because it is "really" a 2000 series....
 

diizzy

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So I was also told I'd need a 3000 series CPU, that 4000 wouldn't work with FreeBSD. And it looks like 3000G series don't do ECC? I guess because it is "really" a 2000 series....
I would imagine that "wouldn't work" possibly refers to video as Ryzen 5000-series worked in 12.2.
That said, I haven't tried itmyself. Here's what Asus says about ECC support in general, https://www.asus.com/support/FAQ/1045186/
 

jmos

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Athlon??? that's an old name... used to be 'crappy server' hardware from AMD back in 1990s, but the name Athlon recently revived by AMD for lower-end chips with integrated graphics.
I really wouldn't call my 2017 bought Athlon X4 845 "crappy hardware from the 90s" (also my 2010 Athlon II X2 250e). You haven't used any of the 2010er Athlons, am I right? IMO they were much better than their reputation.
 
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Todd McComb

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(I have an Athlon now!)

So maybe it's foolish to be insisting on graphics from the CPU when I can just get an inexpensive PCIe graphics card to do web browsing?
 
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