How do you fix a crumbling society?

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Is American society different from European according to your opinion ?
Of course it is. The whole idea of founding the USA was to do many things differently compared to how it was done back then Europe, the USA were the Anti-Europe: democracy, human rights, long and constant need for settlers...

Just compare for example North American cities with European counterparts, this is an own branch of studies in geography, because they are so different.

So while it is of European origin, it evolved in many areas completely different, which remains until today.
 
We are starting to fall into the rabbit hole here, so we need to clean up soon.
There is a global effect of society getting worse, it seems. But there is no use in the blinders shown here. Left versus Right, Liberals, Conservatives, does not matter. Smokescreens. The problem is outside of that, because it is everywhere.
So then where is it?
What vector would influence the entire planet?
Google?
 
The internet for sure. We humans are build for a set of about 50 peers, that is our tribe, family. Once you fill these slots up with like minded people, you suddenly feel that 100% of your peers are thinking like you do. They define where the center of the group is. The problem is that you can find 50 total nutjobs who like X on the internet. Then it may be that you for the life of yourself can not understand why that is fringe, because 100% of your peers think like that. On some level you realize this is wrong, so you may end up attributing reality as wrong (lived experience anyone? feelings?) So either we adopt real fast or we end up with a fragmented society because people think their physical neighbours more alien than the rest of their online friends. Which they never met.

Ok, that is my 2c for now. Keep politics out. Good night.
 
So commenting on a "how-do-you-fix-a-crumbling-society" thread is cool, but mixing in politics is not? Thanks I was not sure.
 
I consider politics , I'm pro libertarian , or I'm pro republican. The rest is just a sharing of some ideas. Which is interesting.
 
I'm just killing time waiting for the big meteor to strike Earth, and send it back to the Stone Age. Some people I know are kinda looking forward to that.
 
Without a meteor, dinosaurs would not have died. And small mammals would not have flourished. As descendants of these small mammals we would not have existed. So thank the meteor which strike earth. Otherwise I would not even write message.
Bye the way, when you eat chicken, it's in fact a dinosaur also...
 
The internet for sure. We humans are build for a set of about 50 peers, that is our tribe, family. Once you fill these slots up with like minded people, you suddenly feel that 100% of your peers are thinking like you do. They define where the center of the group is. The problem is that you can find 50 total nutjobs who like X on the internet. Then it may be that you for the life of yourself can not understand why that is fringe, because 100% of your peers think like that. On some level you realize this is wrong, so you may end up attributing reality as wrong (lived experience anyone? feelings?) So either we adopt real fast or we end up with a fragmented society because people think their physical neighbours more alien than the rest of their online friends. Which they never met.
Agreed, this is certainly a valid point.

Another one I was thinking along: the ever-growing speed of (so-called) innovation. In my youth there were two TV channels, and people would talk about what they had seen the last evening. Now there are 2000, and it is impossible to follow all the things that are presented as new (and often even aren't).
I might assume, that at some point the mind just stalls, like from a DDoS, and does no longer reflect on where that input might connect to (or if it makes sense at all).
Also, this is somehow natural: we are getting told that we must adapt to constant learning, but the mind is not naturally designed for that. In most cases, one would learn some profession, until the age of maybe around 20, and then stay with that and only perfection it within a rather narrow scope (plus one or two hobbies).

When I travelled Asia, in some cases when I asked people in a village how to get to the next city, they couldn't tell me - probably they had never been there. For a tribal society that is just fine - if you ever need to go there, there will be somebody in the village who knows. And in any case they know where they are at home.
Now Phishfry says, this place here feels like home to him. And I can understand that well, on occasion I feel similar. But this place has no location. So now grabbing the stance about "responsibility" from above: how can you take responsibility when you do not have a fix on the location where to start from?
 
I live for more than 50 years in the same town. I'm aware my worldview is limited. But i think i will die in this same town.
At this very moment there are places with war going on, but not here and not now.
If I feel there is a better place, i take the car or plane and i'm gone.
 
It would help when people would consult more different news sources.
I once said (when Trump was president) that I thought Rupert Murdoch and Mark Zuckerberg presented a greater threat to humanity than Vladimir Putin and Donald Trump combined.

That was before Vlad invaded Ukraine. However, I have not changed my mind...
 
Is American society different from European according to your opinion ?
Is American society different from American society? Absolutely.

I often joke that Boston is closer to London than to San Francisco. Geographically it is not quite true, but culturally it has a large grain of truth in it. Similarly, Lissabon is closer to to Salvador de Bahia than to Warsaw, culturally.

On the other hand, here in my neighborhood, the slums of Oakland (high unemployment, ethnically interesting, lots of drugs and crime) are very different from Cupertino (headquarters of Apple, the schools are among the best in the world, the only crime that occurs is tax evasion and investment fraud). This is the tip of a cultural and sociological iceberg. The liberal / wealthy / urbane parts of the US (Boston, Manhattan, Raleigh/Durham, Santa Monica, the San Francisco Bay Area, Seattle) are super different from the conservative / poor / rural parts of the US (Kentucky, Mississippi, New Mexico). And things like Wyoming or Alaska don't even exist in Europe, but they have their own very unique culture. The same massive differences exist within states too, and the Oakland <-> Cupertino example above is just the extreme case.

What is true is that within one country (like Belgium or Poland) Europe is usually more homogeneous, in particular sociologically than the corresponding areas in the US (Poland is about the same population as California, Belgium like Ohio).
 
So commenting on a "how-do-you-fix-a-crumbling-society" thread is cool, but mixing in politics is not? Thanks I was not sure.
Ok, this seems to need some explaining. Political structures are OK, but things like "The libtards are doing this" or "It's all the $DEMOGRAPHIC fault" is not. So when you want to pin some blame on a political party, be precise what they do that is worthy of blame. Maybe they also do things that are good. Making things too easy for yourself is very risky. That way you end up with people shooting their neighbour for looking like a democrat.
 
So then where is it?
What vector would influence the entire planet?
Google?
My two cents; the «system». And as per system I mean the socioeconomic system that chopped the social links and transformed all of us into a dumb consumers. All is a commodity or a service that must be paid.

Is today's internet part of the problem? sure, but because it's a booster that had made the transition from citizens to dumb consumers, and from a society to a herd of isolated and extremist individuals faster and easier (by far more effective than the TV). Google is not the problem, it's an agent.

In my country, before 80's, there were a lot of citizens/neighbors associations working to improve the living conditions in the cities and neighbourhoods. Then, the government started to promote consumers associations and to ignore neighbourhoods associations... back then my father told me; be aware, nothing good will come if we consider ourselves as consumers not as citizens. Don’t know in USA, but in Europe we (the people) have been part of the problem (we were delighted with our affluence, no time to take care of our rights).

So, the problem IMHO is that, now, we are not a society, we are a bunch of consumers and for the «system» we are as valuable as the money we have.
 
My two cents; the «system». And as per system I mean the socioeconomic system that chopped the social links and transformed all of us into a dumb consumers.
Wow. Hobbes, I'm impressed. That is what I needed. This almost sounds like a useable root cause.

be aware, nothing good will come if we consider ourselves as consumers not as citizens. Don’t know in USA, but in Europe we (the people) have been part of the problem (we were delighted with our affluence, no time to take care of our rights).
You put something into words, that I observed, and felt, but could not really express. Last decade I often travelled eastwards, for leasure. And there I found this change just happening. I found it in Poland, where old-style bus stations were replaced by ten-storey glass&metal shopping-malls. I went to the Baltics, and there it was not yet gone so far, and I talked to people (fellow pagans) there and told them that I like the old style better. They pointed me to Belarus: go there, you will like it, you will find still more of the old ways there.

So this apparently is still happening.

Is today's internet part of the problem? sure, but because it's a booster that had made the transition from citizens to dumb consumers, and from a society to a herd of isolated and extremist individuals faster and easier (by far more effective than the TV). Google is not the problem, it's an agent.
Nicely put. So, near 2000, when we "hackers" were still fascinated by the technical possibilites, somebody else must already have figured how to not only use this infrastructure as a marketing instrument, but also to shape society.
Looking at these "agents", it seems they are just a couple of individuals who were lucky to do the right thing at the right moment, and then got incredibly rich. Looking closer, practically all of them came from american private universities.

In my country, before 80's, there were a lot of citizens/neighbors associations
Maybe You should explain this a little more. I have no idea what "neighbours associations" might be - this seems to be something country-specific.

So, the problem IMHO is that, now, we are not a society, we are a bunch of consumers and for the «system» we are as valuable as the money we have.
NPCs. And it's no surprize that occasionally one might have enough of being an NPC.

Back in the old century, somebody told me: look at a news paper and their customers - these are NOT the readers, these are the people who buy advertisement space.
Now in the new century, somebody told me: look at facebook and their users. They are not customers of facebook, they are the product.
Ring a bell, anybody? There was a movie, "the Island", where people are kept as products. (It's actually a script for what to do when one might like to do anything like such to a society. As I said further up: science-fiction is prophecy)
 
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