Other HDD reliability stats for 5 years

Which HDD manufacturer, in your opinion, is less reliable on average?

  • Seagate

    Votes: 4 33.3%
  • WDC

    Votes: 1 8.3%
  • Hitachi

    Votes: 1 8.3%
  • Toshiba

    Votes: 2 16.7%
  • Samsung

    Votes: 2 16.7%
  • HGST

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Maxtor

    Votes: 2 16.7%

  • Total voters
    12
It boggles my mind people still perceive Kingston as a good brand. This self-proclaimed "largest independent memory (module) manufacturer" is average at best and kind of scammy.
Kingston has had other divisions come and go - did you know they used to make SCSI storage enclosures? I suspect their SSD group will be around for a while yet, though. But, as was pointed out earlier, the SSD part change happened some years ago.

I've had good experiences with Kingston, to the extent that when a module failed under their lifetime warranty and they no longer sold it, they either provided a better-spec compatible module, hand-assembled a replacement, or bought a manufacturer's module and had it shipped to me. The last case was on a DEC Alpha DS10 which used unique proprietary modules. They ordered new replacements from HP, directly shipped to me from HP.

Back when SIMM modules were new (instead of individual RAM chips) I categorized vendors into 3 categories:
1) Chip manufacturers who put their chips on their own board and sold them.
2) Board manufacturers who had signed long-term, high-volume agreements to put a chip manufacturer's chips on the board company's board (this is where Kingston fit in).
3) Board "manufacturers" who probably contracted out PCB manufacture and put whatever chips they could get on the board, including different manufacturers on the same board. We called these the "floor sweeping" boards because they used whatever chips they could find on the floor. Note that there is one valid case for different manufacturers - some boards used different chips for the parity bit(s). For example, qty 2 4-bit chips for 8 data bits and qty 1 1-bit chip for parity.

Western Digital has had a habit for over a decade (probably closer to 2) of changing the internal specs of their spinning-rust drives, generally to reduce the number of platters as they increase areal density, without changing the model number. Quite recently, both WD and Seagate were caught passing off shingled (SMR) drives as conventional (CMR) drives, even in their "intended for NAS" product line.
The really stupid thing about this was that they were doing it on their low-capacity drives to save a platter, not on high-capacity drives where it might have had a technical justification. After an initial "most consumers will never notice this" from WD, the global flaming resulted in them admitting it and promising to be more forthcoming in product descriptions going forward. I don't know if Seagate has made the same commitment.

And if you want to talk about scammy (I'd describe this next bit as fraudulent), when a particular memory manufacturer got started, they ground off the tops of the memory chips they were importing and printed a little American flag on the top, along with their own part number. But if you looked at the bottom of the chip, it was imprinted with "KOREA". They also tried to get the US government to sanction/ban the Asian manufacturers for "dumping" (selling below cost) at the same time. That's the reason I refuse to purchase from that memory manufacturer, or their affiliated / house brands, to this day.
 
I suspect their SSD group will be around for a while yet, though. But, as was pointed out earlier, the SSD part change happened some years ago.

The surprising thing is not the part change (that is to be expected), but rather that Kingston maintains better reputation than, say, SanDisk or Transcend. As for the longevity of their SSD business… Samsung/Hynix still need to dump lower quality flash memory somewhere, so, yes, alternative brands have their place.

And if you want to talk about scammy (I'd describe this next bit as fraudulent), when a particular memory manufacturer got started, they ground off the tops of the memory chips they were importing and printed a little American flag on the top, along with their own part number. But if you looked at the bottom of the chip, it was imprinted with "KOREA". They also tried to get the US government to sanction/ban the Asian manufacturers for "dumping" (selling below cost) at the same time. That's the reason I refuse to purchase from that memory manufacturer, or their affiliated / house brands, to this day.

You might have noticed I don't post unsourced claims in this thread. Can I expect the same from you?
 
You might have noticed I don't post unsourced claims in this thread. Can I expect the same from you?
I assume this was regarding the US-flag memory chips based on what you quoted. If not, please elaborate and I'll respond.

This was 35 years ago or so, back when 16Kbit and 64Kbit DIPs were common (in IBM PC clones). I do not have one of these chips at the tip of my fingers, though I likely do have some stored away in obsolete PCs in the basement. However:

Micron US flag on top:
micron-flag-top.jpg

Not my photo - from eBay listing

None of the photos I could find online included pictures of the bottom of the chips (they're boring, so it isn't surprising that they aren't photographed). However, the college I was working at purchased thousands of chips at a time (not unreasonable as 640KB of 64Kbit chips is 90 chips, just for one PC) and we were getting these in factory tubes from authorized distributors. It is certainly possible that Micron sourced these chips from a foreign source due to inventory shortages, but they were marked with the flag on top and "KOREA" molded on the bottom. It is also possible they were counterfeit, but when we contacted Micron to inquire, we never received a response despite inquiring by phone and postal mail several times. I do note that the picture I linked above does show the same ground-down surface instead of the smooth molded surface exhibited by most DIP chips of that era.

"Micron accuses Japan of dumping" from the NY Times. That was just the first one I could find - they have been very vocal about dumping over the years.
 
The surprising thing is not the part change (that is to be expected), but rather that Kingston maintains better reputation than, say, SanDisk or Transcend.
I've had some personal experience with SanDisk SSDs (I mean SSDs with SATA/SAS interfaces, not CF or SD cards), and they were ... not so good, to put it politely. This was just before they were bought by WD, and I hope that those teething problems have been solved.

The absolute high point (in terms of amusement) of "scammy" storage manufacturers must have been MiniScribe. For a few years before going bankrupt, they took disk drive shipping boxes, put bricks in them (yes, bricks, those rectangular pieces of clay or concrete you make houses from), and shipped them between warehouses in different countries. The idea behind that was to confuse investors and auditors into believing that their sales numbers were real. There is an (unverified, second-hand) story that at some point, they made a little mistake, and shipped a pallet load of these to a large customer (large, well-known computer company). The customer found that the top layer of boxes on the pallet contained actual disks, while the rest were bricks. When questioned, MiniScribe had some feeble excuse about using bricks to do quality control testing of their packaging material, and quickly shipped real disks. The good news is that this only cheated investors, at least for a while. Eventually they ran so badly out of money that they couldn't manufacture working drives any longer; at that point, they started taking defective field returns, putting them into new cardboard boxes, and shipping them to customers again. Which ran into trouble when that aforementioned large computer company noticed that the list serial numbers of incoming disk drives seemed to have duplicates against disks from the previous shipments. Oops. Some time later, MiniScribe's management went to jail.
 
...However, the college I was working at purchased thousands of chips at a time (not unreasonable as 640KB of 64Kbit chips is 90 chips, just for one PC) and we were getting these in factory tubes from authorized distributors...
Ah the bad old days. I remember pulling the chips out of those tubes and pressing them (carefully! They were expensive) into either motherboard DIP sockets or into 8-bit ISA(!) memory expansion cards.
 
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