AlpineBSD: why not Free[BSD]?

In my view, this is just another experiment—much like Debian kFreeBSD—and nothing more. NetBSD has `pkgsrc`, which developers tend to overlook, especially on other Unix-like systems. Personally, I think it would have been better for them to join the NetBSD project rather than creating yet another experiment. Besides, those days are long gone when simply building an OS was considered a major achievement. For my part, I’ve made my choice: I’m working less with Linux and opting more for FreeBSD and NetBSD. Just recently, for instance, we set up a Bambu Lab P1S 3D printer with OrcaSlicer on FreeBSD, and everything works perfectly.
 
fahrenheit said:
Ad far as I know NetBSD was choosen because of their anti AI stance. FreeBSD is leaning to "can use but must disclose and the submitter is responsible".
Agree with rootbert the bsd communities are not large enough for endless forks as with Linux
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A fork should at least have a fundamental difference close to the hardware to make itself reasonable.
 
the plan is to avoid "the output of generative AI models (e.g. LLMs)" as far as possible:

"Any software whose code, documentation, binaries, or other assets include, in any part, the output of a generative AI tool such as an LLM, is considered 'tainted' for our purposes."
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When everyone uses mechanized excavators, we will use shovels.
So, you are super strong then?
No, not really.
So, it is just a hobby?
Yeah, pretty much. We just like blisters and when excavators fail, we will have the skills to shovel.
 
LoganGreystone said:
While the developers may think it is a good idea, it seems very difficult to implement and maintain.
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Yes, but if you read this article, https://drewdevault.com/blog/AI-in-Linux/ it becomes clear that politics—whether we like it or not—plays a primary role in the governance of technology. The author argues that Linux is, in essence, politics, and it is difficult, if not nearly impossible, to "fork" oneself away from it. I myself am currently a sort of victim of this technological politics; I find myself having to strike a balance between my own ideals, the prevailing politics, and various manifestos. That is why I have chosen the "path of the samurai" regarding my own working environment. I have to work across Alpine Linux, FreeBSD, OpenBSD, Windows, and Fedora Spin Sway... the nature of my relationship with the *outside* world is such that I cannot defeat it; I am forced to adapt to its modes of communication. For instance, I can’t exactly tell the tax authorities or the utility companies to go to hell just because they insist on using Windows. In fact, I am effectively compelled to submit correspondence to government agencies using specific official fonts, or to fill out forms and documents created in proprietary Word and Excel formats. I suspect that a year or two from now, I will still be juggling the same array of operating systems I mentioned above.
 
USerID said:
Yes, but if you read this article, https://drewdevault.com/blog/AI-in-Linux/ it becomes clear that politics—whether we like it or not—plays a primary role in the governance of technology. The author argues that Linux is, in essence, politics, and it is difficult, if not nearly impossible, to "fork" oneself away from it. I myself am currently a sort of victim of this technological politics; I find myself having to strike a balance between my own ideals, the prevailing politics, and various manifestos. That is why I have chosen the "path of the samurai" regarding my own working environment. I have to work across Alpine Linux, FreeBSD, OpenBSD, Windows, and Fedora Spin Sway... the nature of my relationship with the *outside* world is such that I cannot defeat it; I am forced to adapt to its modes of communication. For instance, I can’t exactly tell the tax authorities or the utility companies to go to hell just because they insist on using Windows. In fact, I am effectively compelled to submit correspondence to government agencies using specific official fonts, or to fill out forms and documents created in proprietary Word and Excel formats. I suspect that a year or two from now, I will still be juggling the same array of operating systems I mentioned above.
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More like way of the Ronin, rather than Samurai :)
Politics is irrelevant in homogeneous society where the strong rule. Otherwise it is constant power struggle for control between tribes and/or cowards/parasites.
Technology, esp. military technology, dictates what sort of system we have. Now it is highly centralized (power gen., water, food, currency, weaponry), to the disadvantage of individual sovereignty.
- Horsemen needed Aristocracy
- Standing armies needed Monarch
- Mass conscripted riflemen needed Democracy
- Nuclear bombs in orbit need Technocracy

When we invent individual use power source, this might change - force shields, energy weapons, automated intelligence/scouts and/or space travel."

Myself, I am huge believer in microkernels, esp. for consumer market but hypervisors too. Stability/availability gains and drivers in userspace can alleviate OS vendor lock-ins.
But monolithic kernel servers in VM will still be a thing, mainly for speed of the VM.
FreeBSD can shine there, freed from driver trap.
Not being untidy mess like Linux, which gained popularity thanks to Docker. And Docker is popular because programs are mess.
Ai can help tidying up.
Avoiding it's use will be detrimental.
It is fun to ride a horse but you need car in the race.
 
USerID said:
That is why I have chosen the "path of the samurai" regarding my own working environment. I have to work across Alpine Linux, FreeBSD, OpenBSD, Windows, and Fedora Spin Sway... the nature of my relationship with the *outside* world is such that I cannot defeat it; I am forced to adapt to its modes of communication.
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I used Windows since 98 and it's the only thing still relatively consistent today; that PHP ordeal had me rolling all 3 primary OS choices for a bit :p (Win10, FreeBSD CURRENT, openSUSE TW)

DanielBowman said:
Not being untidy mess like Linux, which gained popularity thanks to Docker. And Docker is popular because programs are mess.
Ai can help tidying up.
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It's the sysadmin's fault if things are messy :p (and going from one workaround to another imo isn't ideal)

AI can't optimize usefully on-top of abstraction, and sysadmins without experience (knowing what stuff was like without abstraction) can't optimize what they don't understand. AI and "modern" stacks abstract the thoughtfully-optimized code of old to produce modern mediocre results on less-disciplined fresh tech, made to sound better than the old with media buzz.
 
Espionage724 said:
I used Windows since 98 and it's the only thing still relatively consistent today; that PHP ordeal had me rolling all 3 primary OS choices for a bit :p (Win10, FreeBSD CURRENT, openSUSE TW)


It's the sysadmin's fault if things are messy :p (and going from one workaround to another imo isn't ideal)

AI can't optimize usefully on-top of abstraction, and sysadmins without experience (knowing what stuff was like without abstraction) can't optimize what they don't understand. AI and "modern" stacks abstract the thoughtfully-optimized code of old to produce modern mediocre results on less-disciplined fresh tech, made to sound better than the old with media buzz.
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I meant Ai allowing for easier re-writes, not managing the mess somehow, i.e. single binaries. Like we used to roll on MS DOS 😎
 
IDK what it takes for people to understand that "politics" is just what you get when people try to do a thing together. There's no "escaping" it, either. I like wikipedia's top line "Politics is the activity of settling affairs in an organized society"
 
I think the single biggest reason for forks is differences of philosophy and personality conflicts. I know of many expert hackers who have tried to the drink the cool-aid and get involved with particular projects, only to be extremely disappointed in the project management, so they say "I/we can do better". It's a double edged sword though, because my experience has been that projects with draconian oversight tend to be of higher quality, yet they are unavoidably going to alienate folks...I place a higher value on quality than inclusion though.
 
Why mix GNU and BSD in the first place? Why not just use BSD? NetBSD itself is No-AI. There is no advantage in using GNU, and there are many disadvantages. This seems like just another exercise in making "Linux UNIX", just like Debian GNU/kFreeBSD. I predict it will go nowhere.
 
RetroComputingCollector said:
Why mix GNU and BSD in the first place? Why not just use BSD? NetBSD itself is No-AI. There is no advantage in using GNU, and there are many disadvantages. This seems like just another exercise in making "Linux UNIX", just like Debian GNU/kFreeBSD. I predict it will go nowhere.
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What was it even? Linux userland on FreeBSD kernel with executable conversion and system call cross reference? They said it was experimental but I never understood the motivation anyway.
 
Yeah I get the point
I also don't understand the reason of starting this distro stuff with FreeBSD as if it's Linux.
AlpineBSD that is based in NetBSD that is based in FreeBSD
If the goal is to have a minimalist BSD based OS why not just FreeBSD with minimal packages?
Who's interested on maintaining another OS, I mean, what's the purpose of it?
I do understand the GhostBSD as a UI ready FreeBSD OS for those who don't want to waste time setting a DE and have a MATE ready to use, I consider that as a FreeBSD flavor.
I could release my setup and name it HyprBSD as another FreeBSD flavor.
But for Alpine (minimalist) BSD OS? In my opinion it's FreeBSD and that's it.

This is just my point of view.
 
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