A rant about bying online difference different countries.

Example,
DVD box , Scifi blake 7, in US. only Series 4. Price 800Euro , import tax 400Euro -> 1200Euro.
Price in Belgium all four series 60Euro.
Do you have same experience, elsewhere, would like to know. The difference is huge. Here a factor of 80 +
 
Example,
DVD box , Scifi blake 7, in US. only Series 4. Price 800Euro , import tax 400Euro -> 1200Euro.
Price in Belgium all four series 60Euro.
Do you have same experience, elsewhere, would like to know. The difference is huge. Here a factor of 80 +
Does that at least include VAT? 50% is a lot.
 
Example,
DVD box , Scifi blake 7, in US. only Series 4. Price 800Euro , import tax 400Euro -> 1200Euro.
Price in Belgium all four series 60Euro.
Do you have same experience, elsewhere, would like to know. The difference is huge. Here a factor of 80 +

That's private sellers, no?
 
Example,
DVD box , Scifi blake 7, in US. only Series 4. Price 800Euro , import tax 400Euro -> 1200Euro.
Price in Belgium all four series 60Euro.
Do you have same experience, elsewhere, would like to know. The difference is huge. Here a factor of 80 +
I will sell you a blakes 7 dvd for 1190 euros any time, and you get to save ten euros! :)

Or you can buy one for 6 GBP here..
 
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I don't know how much to which country, but in a move which Fox news considers good, the US is charging high tariffs. Depending upon whether voting is suppressed or not, this may change after November, as it does seem much of the US is realizing that promises of prices going down have not turned out to be factual.
 
It will always be possible to get stuff made more cheaply in some third world country with no labour rights, no environmental protection, and import it back into the first world country cheaper than it could be made here, provided there are no import tarrifs to protect the local industry. If it was China 20 years ago, it will be India, Vietnam, Myanmmar or Cambodia today, or perhaps some African countries tomorrow, who knows where they will go next. The end result is a hollowed out economy in the west, with the capability to manufacture just about anything lost for good, and high levels of long-term unemployment, as the people who used to do those manufacturing jobs here are thrown onto the scrap heap. Globalisation has not been without consequences for the west.

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So you get to buy a cheap kettle in wal-mart... but because you lost your well paid manufacturing job to offshoring or foreign competition, that rapidly becomes all that you can afford. So, it all depends on what you want.

Right now, the auto manufacturing industry is busy being destroyed by foreign EV imports. Once it's gone, it will be gone for good, like all the others, with nothing to replace it. You can go and compete with the rest for a job doing burger-flipping on minimum wage instead.
 
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It will always be possible to get stuff made more cheaply in some third world country with no labour rights, no environmental protection, and import it back into the first world country
I've always thought that there is an excellent opportunity right now for a lot of countries to improve their economies this way instead of manufacturing and dealing drugs as some do. So many close to the USA like Latin America or even Cuba could make a deal right now to grab that brass ring and replace China.
 
But then many labours sleep in China , the same company they produce. Day after day. Maybe 11 hours per day. In small closets.
 
I don't think it will go on forever. The US and the west in general has been in "managed decline", as Margaret Thatcher called it, for the last 4 or 5 decades. New global powers are rising as a result and the west may soon lose its dominant position, and be subjugated, which is unlikely to be much fun for the people here. It may already be too late and the process unstoppable. Re-industrialisation behind tarrif barriers is the only way out that I can see for the west; in other words, do the same thing that China has been doing to us for the last 50 years. You can't have an "advanced industrial economy" without any industry, and it doesn't stay "first world" for long. That hypothesis has been tested to destruction over the last 50 years, and the end result is here for all to see:-

 
Economics, is my thing. But i dont kwon if i can talk about it, not violating freebsd guideliness. so i must use general wordings. World trade organisaition not to too bad. you sell i buy. both happy. Have a nice life is sell shuff. You do vice versa. We all nice sweet.
 
Right now, the auto manufacturing industry is busy being destroyed by foreign EV imports.
The auto industry in the USA, Europe and Japan is responsible for it's own downfall:

1. Not resisting ridiculous legislation that added unnecessary complexity, seeing that as a method to increase profits.
2. Designing for assembly and not for maintenance, making life unbearable for technicians resulting in most of them quitting.
3. Using limited life materials for planned obsolescence, excessive use of plastic for engine parts. EOL at 100,000km
4. Designing parts to be model and brand specific instead of being widely used across many brands and models.
5. Exhausting the supply of legally required components when vehicle production ceases to accelerate scrapping.
6. Wet timing belts to destroy engines by 100,000km
7. Rear of engine timing chains to make replacement an uneconomical repair.
8. Digitally coded component authentication to prevent use of used parts as replacements.
9. Electronics with lead-free solder that cannot withstand road vibration
10. Sensors that require expensive calibration increasing the cost of a minor parking shunt 100x
11. Software that is buggy requiring frequent dealer visits for updates, or OTA updates that fail just when you need the vehicle.
12. Surveillance of drivers and passengers, video, audio, messaging, geo-tracking
13. Selling surveillance data to third parties
14. Increasing prices and pushing leasing to hide it in monthly payments
15. Designing in unsafe features that are not illegal but should be, electrically retracting door handles, eyes off the road touchscreen display panel control systems.
16. Lubricating oil formulations and service intervals designed to cause premature engine failure.
17. Engineering components so that owner maintenance and repair is treated as unauthorised tampering
18. Lack of use of open standards, making everything digital proprietary so that regular third party OBD2 tools cause limp home behaviour.
19. Large system assemblies as unrepairable spares instead of individual repair parts. Replacing an entire differential assembly instead of a single worn bearing.
20. Specifying tyre sizes that will no longer be available in ten years and ensuring that replacement sizes are not type approved so that they cannot legally be used in some territories.
21. Limited availability model specific LED headlamps that cost 300x more than a Halogen H4 to replace
22. Megacasting vehicle bodies so that minor traffic accidents mean they are unrepairable, increasing scrap and insurance premiums for all.
23. Subscription payments for features already present in the vehicle

I have been a car enthusiast my entire adult life but I now believe that all of the manufacturers deserve to go bust.
 
>I have been a car enthusiast my entire adult life but I now believe that all of the manufacturers deserve to go bust.
A concise and excellent statement regarding the car industry decline that deserves to be copied and shared. May I? I drive a nearly 60 year old truck for these reasons. I can't even conceive of myself buying a new one.
 
The auto industry in the USA, Europe and Japan is responsible for it's own downfall:

1. Not resisting ridiculous legislation that added unnecessary complexity, seeing that as a method to increase profits.
2. Designing for assembly and not for maintenance, making life unbearable for technicians resulting in most of them quitting.
3. Using limited life materials for planned obsolescence, excessive use of plastic for engine parts. EOL at 100,000km
4. Designing parts to be model and brand specific instead of being widely used across many brands and models.
5. Exhausting the supply of legally required components when vehicle production ceases to accelerate scrapping.
6. Wet timing belts to destroy engines by 100,000km
7. Rear of engine timing chains to make replacement an uneconomical repair.
8. Digitally coded component authentication to prevent use of used parts as replacements.
9. Electronics with lead-free solder that cannot withstand road vibration
10. Sensors that require expensive calibration increasing the cost of a minor parking shunt 100x
11. Software that is buggy requiring frequent dealer visits for updates, or OTA updates that fail just when you need the vehicle.
12. Surveillance of drivers and passengers, video, audio, messaging, geo-tracking
13. Selling surveillance data to third parties
14. Increasing prices and pushing leasing to hide it in monthly payments
15. Designing in unsafe features that are not illegal but should be, electrically retracting door handles, eyes off the road touchscreen display panel control systems.
16. Lubricating oil formulations and service intervals designed to cause premature engine failure.
17. Engineering components so that owner maintenance and repair is treated as unauthorised tampering
18. Lack of use of open standards, making everything digital proprietary so that regular third party OBD2 tools cause limp home behaviour.
19. Large system assemblies as unrepairable spares instead of individual repair parts. Replacing an entire differential assembly instead of a single worn bearing.
20. Specifying tyre sizes that will no longer be available in ten years and ensuring that replacement sizes are not type approved so that they cannot legally be used in some territories.
21. Limited availability model specific LED headlamps that cost 300x more than a Halogen H4 to replace
22. Megacasting vehicle bodies so that minor traffic accidents mean they are unrepairable, increasing scrap and insurance premiums for all.
23. Subscription payments for features already present in the vehicle

I have been a car enthusiast my entire adult life but I now believe that all of the manufacturers deserve to go bust.
I think you will find that most of the items in your list apply to chinese EV's just as much as to western vehicles. It is well known that they become insurance write-offs as soon as there is any fault in the battery, because of the prohibitive cost of replacing the batteries; that's why the insurance premiums are so much higher for EV's than for other cars.

Well, I agree that the western firms have been caught with their pants down on EV's. However, no western private company can compete with this kind of government funding. For comparison, imagine if the UK government had spent 230 billion on our car industry; such a move is unthinkable here.
There is nothing magic about the chinese EV boom, it's just plain old investment and industrial/trade policy that is the key, as always, and having tarrif-free access to your foreign export markets, which has been sold to us here as "free trade". However, western companies have never had tarrif free access to the chinese market; they tightly control all imports and insist on technology transfer, joint manufacturing ventures with local companies, the government "buy china" policy, etc. A friend in shanghai had a made-in-germany merc A-class imported from germany and had to pay a huge tarrif on it. Their government at least recognises that manufacturing is of strategic importance, something that has sadly been lacking in the west, who seem to want to offshore everything they possibly can.

As I said, once those jobs are gone, they will never come back. There's nothing to replace it. Try living in the north of england if you don't believe me; I know, I've done it. Or go take a walk round Merthyr. How much unemployment do you want? Sometimes I go down to the big container port in southampton and watch the huge container ships bringing all the manufactured goods in. Those containers generally go back empty, there's nothing going the other way.
 
in some third world country with no labour rights, no environmental protection, and import it back into the first world country cheaper than it could be made here, [...] If it was China 20 years ago, it will be India, Vietnam, Myanmmar or Cambodia today, or perhaps some African countries tomorrow
1. We don't use certain terms anymore, such as "third world countries". It's demeaning.
Of course we don't change our discriminating, discrediting, demeaning, and arrogant point of view and behaviour, and for sure don't allow them actually to "develop" (formerly we called that "aid", now we named it "collaboration") this was a danger to our economy completely based on exploitation (We recycle paper, glass and aluminium, so nobody can say we throw away everything. And before some smarty comes with 'also plastics!': No, we only collect it, but not really recycle it. Well, it's burned in plants, which is called "thermal recycling", but only a very small percentage is produced from used plastic.)
We not only refuse them medication drugs if they cannot pay our prices, we even forbid them to produce those themselves for their own market, so they could afford them. That's not discrimination, that's economy.
Using certain terms is discriminating. Behave discriminating is not.
We are the masters of doing changes prima facie without really change anything.

2. China already outsourced "lower labour" to Africa, such as assembling cable harnesses.
Example: We let "China" produce a cheap PSU for us. So we don't need to care about working conditions (we are exemplary at those, but others better don't dare to follow that example - too expensive), how they get their resources, or their power, doesn't bother us at all, as long as no chinese company takes over a mine we want to exploit ourselves; especially not, when they make a better offer. We are very for free markets - as long as they serve only us. Every year some dozens of chinese miners die in a collapsing mine. To us that's just some thrill in the evening news, but no connection to us. Our coal is too expensive (because of the conditions), and too dirty. We have clean renewable energy (exemplary), while China's power supply is still based on ~80% fossils. Not our problem. And we believe, they produce this PSU all within their own country. Even if we think so, they are not stupid. The chinese manufacturers get resources from Africa, Asia and South America like us (believe it or not, but we are not the only clever ones on this planet), transport the wires to a contract manufacturer in Africa who produce the harnesses with plugs, the harnesses are transported back to China, the PSU is assembled, and then transported to the first class world countries. (That is allowed to say.)
And when the PSU has done its job - defective, or functioning errorless, but trashed together with the also still errorless working but alas obsolete machine, or because a new one was greener in its usage, no matter how much resources, waste and CO2 its production cost - we throw it into some african landfill, because it's better to us when other children climbing in sharp and edgy landfills, breathing the smoke of the open bonfires, which flare of the wire's plastic coatings, so to sell us the copper for us to recycle for a pittance. That's a job worth doing. Recycling electronics is not.
Because of our arrogance, to us Europeans Africa is still a blind spot. Lying directly at our doorstep we don't even see (nor care) China is applauded there. Because they don't just send them "development aid" to exploit their resources for dumping prices, which they also do like us, which outrages us; especially the conditions those poor Africans have to suffer under chinese labour (discrimination.) While ours are pretty the same, which does not outrages us. Of course not. That's economy. Nor they pointing at "those lazy bums" and "how ugly they destroy their own homelands" (try to elect a government that wants to change this, and see what happen: They need to be freed from this communistic terror regime), but they involve them into the production chain.
We just become upset about everything, but change nothing.

That's cynical, you say? Yes, it is. But it's not me, the reality is.
Killing the messenger is another trick we can pull greatly.
 
Like I said, it's not going to go on forever. Taking the UK as an example, the debt interest is forecast to be 123 billion pounds this year alone. That is a huge drag on the economy; it's like trying to walk around with an iron ball chained to your foot, or like someone charging you $100k a month rent on your apartment.
During the recent Liz Truss premiership the country came close to a bond market meltdown, when international finance said "no more". It was only rescued by an emergency bailout by the BoE. We are currently getting close to that same situation again, if you watch the gilts chart.

And britain is being found out in other ways too. The state of affairs shown in this video would have been unthinkable in the 70s or 80s, or even the 2000's.
The truth is that the country has become much poorer in real terms and can no longer afford what it used to have, and has lost much of the capacity to manufacture it.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gru2EDJvj9Q

You can't have an "advanced industrial economy" without any industry. It doesn't work.
 
China already outsourced "lower labour" to Africa
China is starting to build EVs in Budapest. The news story I heard just yesterday is they are employing slave labor tactics by importing their own citizens and working them 12 hour days, 7 days a week which has caught the ire of human rights activists and the law.
 
Back in the 1980s, when the Chevrolet Corvette was still produced in my town, a co-worker's brother was a big Corvette enthusiast and arranged a tour of the plant and invited me along. It was there we found out that they allowed over 200 defects in the body and paint work on each car to the horror of the brother.
 
I have worked with a bunch of chinese colleagues from the same US company, they came to visit us here, we went to visit them in their lab in shanghai. They told me the dream job for most chinese engineers is to get into an international company, as they call western companies, because of the better pay and conditions. They used to tell me working for firms like Huawei is very tough, let alone smaller chinese companies that are even worse. There are no independent labour unions in china, they are illegal under communism, that might be part of the reason.
 
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