Are liquor stores really essential businesses?

Phishfry said:
We need to make sure that people stay healthy and not drunk during a state of emergency.
The liquor stores close during hurricanes but stay open during a medical emergency. That is ludicrous.

My feeling is that we should also stop the sales of cigarettes. Last thing we need during a medical crisis is people polluting their lungs.

What do you think?
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Isn't the NAVY playing it awesome?
Quarantined sailors are not allowed to leave their rooms. Their meals are placed on the floor outside their hotel doors three times a day, and alcohol and outside food are not allowed in.
These sailors have not even been given keys to their rooms. If they try sneaking out, the doors will lock behind them and they will need a military police officer — one of whom is keeping watch on every floor — to let them back in. They do have access to Wi-Fi and cable television, and are allowed to smoke on their balconies, if their room has one.
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Source: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/05/us/politics/coronavirus-aircraft-carrier-roosevelt-crozier.html

The cure is Wi-Fi + smoking on the balkony.
But don't do this at home kids! You need lungs like a SEAL.

With your hypothesis "no alcohol" you certainly could qualify for a rear admiral as long as you won't seek advise from Internet forums.
 
(I am not following this thread but...) I saw my first CDC television spot which tells people to calm down, essentially, and that you're not likely to get the virus and even less likely to die from it. That comes on the heels of ads from toilet paper manufacturers and food vendors telling people to quit hoarding these things cause there is no shortage. Voices of reason are starting to make their appearance, finally, as people have learned to turn off the television "news" fear mongering (which such things they live for).
 
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drhowarddrfine said:
I am not following this thread but...
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Yeah, probably the best way to contribute here ...
drhowarddrfine said:
spot which tells people to calm down, essentially, and that you're not likely to get the virus and even less likely to die from it.
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See what Bert the Turtle has to deliver: Duck and Cover


The postmodern variation is to hide one's head in the sand, as the virus won't enter the backside.
 
Popper, Karl. The Open Society and Its Enemies. Routledge, 1945.
Again, we have only to read the daily papers to observe that propaganda (the modern counterpart of rhetoric) depends largely for its success on confusing the meaning of the terms.
If politicians were compelled by law to define any term they wished to use, they would lose most of their popular appeal, their speeches would be shorter, and many of their disagreements would be found to be purely verbal.
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getopt said:
you certainly could qualify for a rear admiral as long as you won't seek advise from Internet forums.
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I was an enlisted man so Command Master Chief would be more in line.
Maybe I was brainwashed, by my time in the Navy, into these decisions.
To me it seems more like a common sense decision.
I would like to add vaping to that list. Probably three times worse for your lungs.
 
fernandel and other Russia Today propadanda "readers".
Our FreeBSD Forums do not deserve this political propaganda.

This is a call for for a wise and decent decision to close this thread.
 
getopt said:
fernandel and other Russia Today propadanda "readers".
Our FreeBSD Forums do not deserve this political propaganda.

This is a call for for a wise and decent decision to close this thread.
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Slavoj Zizek is well known philosopher around the world. I red above link in the europen news and when I search for the link I found on RT and I didn't search more because was the same as I did read.
If you have a time and patients you will find more around in the France newspapers and in British too.
 
fernandel said:
I red above link in the europen news and when I search for the link I found on RT and I didn't search more because was the same as I did read.
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fernandel, don't get this wrong. While I respect your and others personal opinion, and philosophical thoughts are always welcome, please select your sources more carefully when linking.

We have got the forum rules "no politics" and we should respect them even if moderators seem to be absent. But for sure we do not deserve spreading propaganda bullhorn sources here.
 
getopt said:
Go NAVY! :)
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Not exactly. In the military, nobody goes. Your DI will see to that. And the only navy using feet for movement would be using those ships of the desert.

And with this we go back to the original topic, which broadly would be "which infrastructure is essential now?".
 
Crivens said:
Your DI will see to that.
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Code: 
> wtf -o DI
wtf: I don't know what `DI' means!

But I know the term 'Go Navy' which you don't.

Nevertheless I appreciate that you set a clear signal with
Crivens said:
And with this we go back to the original topic, which broadly would be "which infrastructure is essential now?".
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and I hope moderators keep an eye on that
and enforce the forum rule "no politics".
 
That is a generic 'you'. If you ever had a DI, personally, there is little chance not to notice that guy or forget that he existed.

But back on topic - I just learned that one brewery decided to donate the alcohol from the 0% beer process to hospitals et al. They are using the existing botteling system they have, so you might run into complete cases of brand bottles containing stuff closer to 100% than expected. So yes, liquor stores are important and the medic with that green bottle may be carrying sanitizer and no beer.
 
The Navy called bootcamp personal 'Company Commanders'. I was never called rock so many times in my life...

He is the official US list of essential personal that was used at work to justify my shipyard staying open.
Ship Repair falls under two categories for my shop. Transportation and Defense Industrial Base.

Guidance on the Essential Critical Infrastructure Workforce | CISA

www.cisa.gov www.cisa.gov
I don't see Liquor Stores anywhere on the list.
Liquor stores are non-essential unless they are government owned. Then government makes their own rules so they can fake it..
 
Phishfry said:
I don't see Liquor Stores anywhere on the list.
Liquor stores are non-essential unless they are government owned.
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Yes, you might be right about that. But honestly I don't see a reason why this should be discussed here on a IT-related forum that is not dedicated to US domestic Gov matters. There are more demanding problems in these times like triaging humans for ventilator access.
 
Phishfry said:
I don't see Liquor Stores anywhere on the list.
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They definitely go into the highlighted category, see a quote from your link:
FOOD AND AGRICULTURE
Workers supporting groceries, pharmacies, convenience stores, and other retail (including unattended and vending) that sells human food, animal/pet food and pet supply, and beverage products, including retail customer support service and information technology support staff necessary for online orders, pickup and delivery.
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getopt said:
There are more demanding problems in these times like triaging humans for ventilator access.
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Ahem, not here. Triaging is when the sticky brown stuff has hit the rotating whirly bit. We don't do this here. And even in times of trouble you need some soul food. That is why even in combat rations, there is some sweets and coffee/tea. It holds up your spirits, your body could survive on stuff like the Seven Seas Ship Rations, but after some days you wish it wouldn't.

And that is how I see a beer in the evening, or this thread. When it is so bad that we can't spare the time for this or the beer/chocolade/coffee/whatever we are in real trouble. Then it impacts your will to carry on.

And you should not use triage as an argument, ever. Those who have to do that mostly never forgive themselves, some implode later on. Those who don't need watching. Those who crave it need close watching, preferably trough a scope.
 
Crivens said:
Ahem, not here. Triaging is when ..
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Triaging is done, when short resources (for whatever reason) have to be allocated due to increased demand (for whatever reason).

Triaging is done all the times everywhere on earth. Usually you (generic you) don't see, hear or smell it. And in peace times you don't call it triage. Therefore let me use the more appropriate term allocation.

Want some not so scaring examples?

Say you have left a small number of SARS-Cov2 test sets. Outside are lining up big numbers of persons who need to be tested. The usual method is first come first serve. But due the fact the shortage is known and the crowd has been seen, you were told to use the remaining tests in a most productive manner. Now you have to allocate your sets by practicing selection: You get the test and sorry you do not get it. It is not told to the people is such a cruel manner. Most people is told to show up on a later time, but a few is told to line up in room XY. In some regions donations/paying "handling fees" can speed up the process significantly after having heard "come tomorrow". Obviously you need some method and rules for doing allocation as corruption increases in times of shortages (FFP-masks: rubbery even on top state level).

And in certain places resources are hold back even if man on the street started dying. Those resources are reserved to relevant VIPs in case they need it without delay.

If you are telling a cancer patient that his operation has to be postponed you don't tell him that he got triaged.

If a collided and almost died biker was sent to a long distance trip instead to the nearby medical center which could do it perfectly, he was triaged.

Keep on saying "not here"?

For not missing some IT-related thoughts here in our glory digital era where distributed apps are expected to 'save the world': Why not using an algorithm for decisions that scares the staff? Algorithms could perfectly hide the triage problem from everyone.

The remaining question is: Why got we hit on short resources? Why do markets fail? Why are the huge profits from normal/peace times (in a few pockets) not a solution for suffering populations?

Sixpacks in the fridge tend to prevent thinking about such questions. Therefore alcoholic beverages for the masses are system relevant.
 
getopt said:
But honestly I don't see a reason why this should be discussed here on a IT-related forum that is not dedicated to US domestic Gov matters.
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Well, then, let me help You out on a reason. First and very important, this is not an US forum, it is planetscope (that includes Russia).
Second, what is "essential" for people should also not be decided solely by the US.

Another example:
My mom complains that she cannot buy the seeds to plant her food (now is the season, this cannot be done later), because government has banned the sale of gardening equip & seeds (i.e. growing the food for the next winter) as "non-essential".
They appear to have eagerly grabbed the chance to finally get rid of people growing their own food and force them to buy the monsanto-junkfood from the supermarket instead (and buy a car first to even get there and fetch the crap).

Those who are dependent on the liquor-stores are in a later stage of this same process: they have already given up on making their own schnaps, and are now slaves of the government.

What has this to do with IT? Nothing.
And, what has this to do with FreeBSD? Everything.

Because, we are in the same process: the powers-in-place do not like us. They would prefer us to throw away our computers, and buy windows computers instead, then buy some games, buy some music clips, buy some tv-on-demand, and that is all we are supposed do. And they will be looking for ways to force us to do so.

So, if you don't like discussions about politics, then at some point you may not have a cause to discuss Berkeley either, because there will be no Berkeley anymore.

I cannot see any substantial difference, between
  • someone growing their own food instead of buying it from the supermarket
  • someone crafting their own OS instead of buying windows
  • someone distilling their own schnaps instead of buying it from the liquor-store
  • someone entertaining their own thinking instead of buying pre-fabricated learning-targets from 'established' media.
The powers-in-place and the government hate all of these likewise, because this is all about the same: about DIY, about staying independent from gratification/withdrawal experiments in behaviourism.
getopt said:
The remaining question is: Why got we hit on short resources? Why do markets fail? Why are the huge profits from normal/peace times (in a few pockets) not a solution for suffering populations?

Sixpacks in the fridge tend to prevent thinking about such questions. Therefore alcoholic beverages for the masses are system relevant.
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Indeed, these are good questions. But I don't subscribe to Your viewpoint about alcohol. It reminds me of the viewpoint of Theodor Adorno, who thought that the masses would start to think if you only make them suffer enough.

That doesn't work, it is a sadist's viewpoint. People do think when they feel a delight in thinking, just like they do gardening when they feel a delight when doing so, or hack computers because they have fun doing that, or, like my eastern friends, make their own beverages because they enjoy to do so.
 
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