Other Software modeling / UML tooling

cracauer@ said:
It is odd that Wine on FreeBSD is so much worse than on Linux. You'd think they would be mostly equivalent. Do you have an specific error messages?
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Spent about 40+ hours around 3 months ago now, so not sure anymore what the specific error messages were.

I spent a ton of time getting Wine working on Devuan 64-bit because I had to figure out how to get wine to run 32-bit and/or 64bit applications.

Installed Wine on FreeBSD and had nothing but errors. Could not even install my old 32-bit paradox desktop database I've been running on Wine for 10 years.

So yes, I would say Wine on FreeBSD is "so much worse" than on Linux.

I finally gave up on Wine/FreeBSD. Working on an alternate solution.

NOT giving up on FreeBSD!
.
 
kpedersen said:
[FONT=monospace]Dave-D[/FONT] Perhaps try either 32-bit or 64-bit if one doesn't work?
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I tried to install FreeBSD 32-bit but there are major issues with ZFS on 32-bit, I'm pretty sure the reason was that ZFS is 64-bit. So the combination of 64-bit ZFS on 32-bit FreeBSD is not a good choice. Discovered this from research undertaken because FreeBSD was throwing errors right after installing FreeBSD 32-bit with ZFS filesystem. I want to stick with ZFS rather than using UFS. So 32-bit FreeBSD was a non-starter for me.

I've tried the 32-bit route with Devuan 32-bit with Wine 32-bit. The problem I had was that some software is now 64-bit only, so going with 32-bit only was a non-starter, as I'm pretty sure I couldn't install 64-bit Wine on 32-bit Devuan.

So after a ton of trial and error, I had 64-bit Devuan working with Wine 64-bit and 32-bit. A long and large custom install, but it worked great.
 
Alain De Vos said:
There are the softwares:
graphics/dia
devel/umbrello
devel/argouml
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Still, I doubt if any of those can come close to Sparx Enterprise Architect.

Likely "no comparison" - not even close - not even in the same league.

Let me know if I'm wrong.

The only possibility I've found so far (maybe) is "Visual Paradigm." But then, likely the same basic issues as far as getting a workable solution to play nice with FreeBSD.
 
I actually work in a place where that kind of software makes sense... And the way to handle it at my workplace would be to get a win10 VM, and give it enough hardware. So, Dave-D , you basically painted yourself into a corner with just 2 options:
  1. Actual win10 machine with Sparx Enterprise Architect and RDP.
  2. A VM with win10, Sparx Enterprise Architect and RDP. Yeah, that VM can then live on FreeBSD (it does have a working implementation of VirtualBox, after all, in ports).
Forget about Wine - even gamers struggle with it. I wouldn't trust Wine in a corporate environment. 🤷‍♂️
 
Dave-D said:
I tried to install FreeBSD 32-bit but there are major issues with ZFS on 32-bit, I'm pretty sure the reason was that ZFS is 64-bit. So the combination of 64-bit ZFS on 32-bit FreeBSD is not a good choice.
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Oh sorry, I should have been clearer:

Run a 64-bit FreeBSD but a 32-bit version of Wine (if the 64-bit version isn't working) and supporting userland.

So i.e set up a 32-bit FreeBSD jail on your 64-bit system and run Wine in there. It sounds like a faff (kinda is) but sometimes that works better than the WoW64 emulation stuff.

The reason this occasionally works better (sticking with homogenous 32-bit) is because most 64-bit Windows software is often mixed arch (64-bit with 32-bit cruft. Either the installer, the DRM services, etc).
 
I run a game on 64 bit FreeBSD in Wine 32 bit mode. I don't even recall the install process, there were no obstacles.

And kpedersen is right, I have seen quite a few 64 bit Windows programs that had 32 bit accessories, e.g. the launcher.
 
astyle said:
A VM with win10, Sparx Enterprise Architect and RDP. Yeah, that VM can then live on FreeBSD (it does have a working implementation of VirtualBox, after all, in ports).
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How have I "painted myself into a corner?"

So what you're saying is Use Windows by installing within a virtual machine within my FreeBSD server?
I thought about that but I'm not sure I want Windows running on my FreeBSD server at all.

I despise Windows now for many years and for many reasons. Most if not all of the reasons have proven to be valid.

Problem is, we still live in a "windows" world, whether we like it or not (I DON'T), I plan on getting rid of Windows ASAP.

Three big problems:
1. Accounting software - again, what my old DOS program did 22+ years ago, many accounting programs do not understand and still to this day, they don't get it right. Even worse, many of the "better" accounting programs have been gobbled up by large corporations. Can you say "control?" So all you're basically left with in the windows world is to pay tons of money to be under someone else's control. Any way you look at it, it's "embrace the suck." Open source is the only way to go. Many of those are way behind, seem to be few usable options.
2. Desktop Database software (WITH referential integrity, which paradox did 22 years ago but few these days seem to understand, let alone get right.) Basically, if you don't have referential integrity, then YOU DONT have a database. Period. Example: Kexi STILL doesn't have referential integrity. Libreoffice base? Can't make your own program with your own menu structure and lock it down so user can't make changes. Those out of the mainstream tend to go away. I know of no other desktop-level database options. I used the Paradox desktop database to quickly hack things together when a quick solution is needed. Version 9 runs on linux under wine, I ran it that way for 10+ years.
3. Enterprise - level information systems design software, like Sparx Enterprise Architect, that is not a toy.
 
Paradox! Quite a trip down memory lane. I remember a guy I used to work with sweating bullets to port his programs from Ashton-Tate Dbase 4 to Paradox. He gave up and migrated to Foxpro instead. Any reason why Sqlite won't work for you?

Edit: OP has already started several threads on installing WINE. Removed likely unhelpful links.
 
Jose said:
Any reason why Sqlite won't work for you?
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SQLite is only used for embedded single-user.
Most desktop databases can be accessed with at least a few users, say up to 5 or 10.

Plan on using PostgreSQL and/or Firebird SQL for the bigger stuff.

The main purpose is to hack together quick apps, etc ==> An easy to use front end with included referential-capable backend database, ability to query, build quick forms, easily manipulate data, etc. Usually under 5 users, don't need big iron databases at this point.
 
Jose said:
Edit: OP has already started several threads on installing WINE. Removed likely unhelpful links.
Click to expand...

Yes, well me and Wine, we've been through a battle or two.

Jose said:
Paradox! Quite a trip down memory lane.
Click to expand...
I've never found anything so easy and capable for quick and dirty hacks.
Version 9 was said to work on linux/wine.
I've run version 9 on Devuan/wine for years without any major issues.

Sad that nothing approaching Paradox is available some 20+ years latter.
Basically killed off by more of Microsofts dirty deeds.
Same thing with Delphi, although Delphi lives silently on.
 
Dave-D said:
I despise Windows now for many years and for many reasons. Most if not all of the reasons have proven to be valid.
Click to expand...

How old can you go with regards to Sparx Enterprise Architect versions?

Can you run an older version of Windows from a time when Microsoft were slightly less criminal? For UML, personally I use Windows 2000 for Rational Rose and am quite happy with it. (Grady Booch himself designed that one ;))

Or since Linux is Wine's reference platform, can you run Linux in a VirtualBox, Bhyve VM and run Sparx via Wine in that?

There are *loads* of solutions but admittedly most are a little bit of a faff.
 
Jose said:
Paradox! Quite a trip down memory lane....
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and others... ;)(unfortunately bhyve does not support Windows NT 3.51 as a guest OS. VMWare too. Only Virtualbox). Sorry for spam...
winnt351.png
 
Dave-D said:
How have I "painted myself into a corner?"

So what you're saying is Use Windows by installing within a virtual machine within my FreeBSD server?
I thought about that but I'm not sure I want Windows running on my FreeBSD server at all.

I despise Windows now for many years and for many reasons. Most if not all of the reasons have proven to be valid.

Problem is, we still live in a "windows" world, whether we like it or not (I DON'T), I plan on getting rid of Windows ASAP.
Click to expand...
You painted yourself into a corner by becoming political about avoiding Windows at all costs. What happened to "Picking the right tool for the job" ? As in, pick what works. These days, there's a distinct downside to everything.

I guess one way to put this is: Are you gonna make everyone else wait for months (and cost them productivity) while you satisfy your anti-Windows urges? I don't think you can get the rest of your company onboard with that kind of attitude.

There's nothing stopping you from getting rid of Windows on your personal machines, but when your job is involved, don't make others waste their time waiting for you.
 
kpedersen said:
I appreciate this kind of spam ;)

At risk of derailing this thread, how did you get such a high resolution for NT 3.51? Is it via the "Bear Windows" drivers or is it VirtualBox specific?
Click to expand...
I created this virtual machine a long time ago, back on Debian Buster... I found a floppy image from which I installed the drivers.

winnt351video_drv.png
 
It seems these drivers are VB specific...

winnt351_video_drv.png




Sorry again.
I won't divert main discussion any more

PS. I have attached the images because the Guest Additions cannot be installed on a WinNT3.51 guest, so copying between guest and host is not possible.
 
Back on topic, please.

One of the first things you need when you run a business, is a Database.
Especially these days. Every business with any level of intelligence runs from a database.
In some countries that database is a notepad and file folders.
In the USA, we use computers.

The point is not Paradox (yes, old and 'out of date' - but still not replaced by the industry with anything 'new and up to date.')
Why else would I still be using it for the job stated?

The main point is Getting Sparx Enterprise Architect (which is very 'up to date') to play along with FreeBSD on the Desktop,
So that I can design databases.
 
Dave-D said:
Back on topic, please.

One of the first things you need when you run a business, is a Database.
Especially these days. Every business with any level of intelligence runs from a database.
In some countries that database is a notepad and file folders.
In the USA, we use computers.

The point is not Paradox (yes, old and 'out of date' - but still not replaced by the industry with anything 'new and up to date.')
Why else would I still be using it for the job stated?

The main point is Getting Sparx Enterprise Architect (which is very 'up to date') to play along with FreeBSD on the Desktop,
So that I can design databases.
Click to expand...
I pointed out what would work. So have others in this thread.

Yeah, Open Source software that is available in FreeBSD ports may be standards-compliant, but it doesn't have feature parity with commercial offerings.

One viable solution is to redesign the entire workflow and learn to work with what Open Source provides - for free.

Another solution is to stick with the commercial package, pay for a license, and accept the related downsides like running that package on Windows.

If you want to combine the commercial package with "FreeBSD on the Desktop", the only way to do that is via a Windows VM on FreeBSD. VirtualBox is a pretty reliable example of that.

And if you don't like that, you're stuck.

In US, BTW, only the Army sticks to the way of working with data in the way that you describe, while the civilian business world has moved on. Only in the Army would people be stuck with someone whose specific, non-standard urges have an entire company on hold. Not to mention the rest of the planet is laughing at that 🤣 Just look at Musk.

C'mon, man, have some respect for the international community on these Forums!
 
_al said:
and others... ;)(unfortunately bhyve does not support Windows NT 3.51 as a guest OS. VMWare too. Only Virtualbox). Sorry for spam...
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That is super cool. NT 3.51 would run quite happily on 16MB of RAM if memory serves. I remember NT 3.1 required 8, and no one had that much back in the early '90s.

Dave-D said:
One of the first things you need when you run a business, is a Database.
...
Click to expand...
There are several high-quality, high-performance free and open source databases available to you in Freebsd. What you want is an integrated database and GUI forms package. Unfortunately Microsoft Abcess pretty much killed all the competition back in the '90s. This is not a Freebsd-specific problem.

Maybe you can cobble something together using Jupyter notebooks. Maybe not. It's not an area that interests me.

towardsdatascience.com

Bring your Jupyter Notebook to life with interactive widgets

How to create dynamic dashboards using ipywidgets
towardsdatascience.com towardsdatascience.com
cloudxlab.com

How to access databases using Jupyter Notebook | CloudxLab Blog

SQL is a very important skill. You not only can access the relational databases but also big data using Hive, Spark-SQL etcetera. Learning SQL could help you excel in various roles such as Business Analytics, Web Developer, Mobile Developer, Data Engineer, Data Scientist, and Data Analyst...
cloudxlab.com cloudxlab.com
 
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Jose said:
There are several high-quality, high-performance free and open source databases available to you in Freebsd.
Click to expand...
I agree. I plan on using PostgreSQL and/or Firebird SQL for the big stuff.
Jose said:
What you want is an integrated database and GUI forms package.
Click to expand...
Exactly. Thank you for understanding.
Something quick and dirty used for hacking together little custom apps.
The reason I still use Paradox -> Because I've never found a replacement.
Jose said:
Unfortunately Microsoft Abcess pretty much killed all the competition back in the '90s. This is not a Freebsd-specific problem.
Click to expand...
Exactly. But it wasn't just Access.
Microsoft's dirty tricks have destroyed many good things.

This stuff is nothing new,
and your right, its not a FreeBSD problem.
It's a mine field. By design.
The hardest part about working with computers has always been fighting the mentality that causes these problems.
The only real solution = Walk Away.
Exactly why I went open source ASAP (various flavors of linux => FreeBSD) and got out of the computer consulting business.

Basically, you have to figure your way through the mine-field,
then if possible, work on eliminating the mine-field.

I will find a solution.

It's called FREEDOM.
 
Freedom to leave everyone else hanging while you satisfy your anti-windows urges?

US civilian business world has the least patience with that kind of attitude.
 
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