For Anyone Using AI in Their Workflow

this is the exact reason why our organization does not cooperate with United States based software services.

That’s not really true. I could show you a map of the general area where I live and if you actually work for the German government, you’d also know exactly who I work for so your comment sounds like a personal opinion, not an official one.
 
Unpredictable? What kind of AI are we talking about generative AI? Sure, but that’s a feature
Not sure, but whatever seems to let people provide something to an AI and have it output some kind of code.

I don't agree with any time spent vetting that outputted code vs using it as-is quickly (what's the point of double-vetting if I can make the code myself, trust it upfront, and improve upon it), and argue time spent vetting AI-asstisted outputted code could be spent human-creatively creating the code from scratch.

I don't count AI assisted code as a programming tool since the AI output has to have human bias somewhere; a machine bulk-collecting human research papers and making sense of it still needs human bias for how to understand the 1s and 0s of information and output it to something a human can use, and all that output and prettification comes with motivations and financials.

Computers don't code themselves and don't understand anything beyond code. I like the idea of manually writing something to do something on a computer before having it tell me something that's ok to run on it :p
 
Not sure, but whatever seems to let people provide something to an AI and have it output some kind of code.

I don't agree with any time spent vetting that outputted code vs using it as-is quickly (what's the point of double-vetting if I can make the code myself, trust it upfront, and improve upon it), and argue time spent vetting AI-asstisted outputted code could be spent human-creatively creating the code from scratch.

I don't count AI assisted code as a programming tool since the AI output has to have human bias somewhere; a machine bulk-collecting human research papers and making sense of it still needs human bias for how to understand the 1s and 0s of information and output it to something a human can use, and all that output and prettification comes with motivations and financials.

Computers don't code themselves and don't understand anything beyond code. I like the idea of manually writing something to do something on a computer before having it tell me something that's ok to run on it :p

Not sure, but whatever seems to let people provide something to an AI and have it output some kind of code.
That's called generative ai.

I don't agree with any time spent vetting that outputted code vs using it as-is quickly (what's the point of double-vetting if I can make the code myself, trust it upfront, and improve upon it), and argue time spent vetting AI-asstisted outputted code could be spent human-creatively creating the code from scratch.
Irrelevant when you’re using code from online third-party sources. Did you do any vetting on all of them or freebsd-src? And you’re clearly talking about people who use AI to exclusively code their entire project. You didn’t even read what this topic is about, or you would have seen that I was very specific about AI usage. That's called blind prejudice.

I don't count AI assisted code as a programming tool since the AI output has to have human bias somewhere; a machine bulk-collecting human research papers and making sense of it still needs human bias for how to understand the 1s and 0s of information and output it to something a human can use, and all that output and prettification comes with motivations and financials.
Your comment makes no since. Thats like saying a car isn't a car because a enganeer didn't like seatbelts. Everything has human bias that is created by humans. Even children!!!

Computers don't code themselves and don't understand anything beyond code.
Actualy computers do code themselves and at the same time you contradicted your own statement.

I like the idea of manually writing something to do something on a computer before having it tell me something that's ok to run on it
That's fine but this topic wasn't even about you it was a message in support to those who like AI, you just came here jumped off topic to give me an oppionion I didnt ask for.
 
Despite my feelings on the topic, I can agree that one should not be attacked for their choice of whether or not they use AI. However, I cannot see how this post is in any way in service of that goal.

I cannot see what you hope to achieve with this post other than venting your personal frustration.

This certainly does not put AI users in a better light considering the tone of your initial comment or replies. Demanding dissenters provide code to prove they are "Real Programmers" rings particularly ironic given your earlier statement:
Constructive criticism is valuable empty gatekeeping isn’t.

I cannot see what you hope to accomplish by asking for tolerance while seemingly being so intolerant of those that disagree.
 
I find it ironic that people who oppose AI felt the need to come into a space meant for those who enjoy using it, just to share opinions that weren’t even being asked for.
 
I find it ironic that people who oppose AI felt the need to come into a space meant for those who enjoy using it, just to share opinions that weren’t even being asked for.
Off-topic's fair game :p

I like light-hearty promoting balance occasionally :cool: (or I guess casually showing not everyone's into AI)
 
Despite my feelings on the topic, I can agree that one should not be attacked for their choice of whether or not they use AI. However, I cannot see how this post is in any way in service of that goal.

It’s right in the first paragraph: “To everyone on these forums who appreciates AI you have allies here.”So there shouldn’t be an issue unless you have a problem with people who appreciate AI supporting each other.
This certainly does not put AI users in a better light considering the tone of your initial comment or replies. Demanding dissenters provide code to prove they are "Real Programmers" rings particularly ironic given your earlier statement:
You’re acting like AI users are the ones viewed negatively. In reality, far more people use AI than don’t the anti-AI crowd is the minority. The “bad look” comes from attacking people for using tools.
Also, this is my forum topic. I created it specifically as a space for people who use AI to support each other. If you’re here to criticize, then back it up: show your code and show why your opinion should carry any weight.
I cannot see what you hope to achieve with this post other than venting your personal frustration.
I am not a slave and your not my master, if I want to create a topic on these forums provided I comply with forum rules you have no place to say anything to me at all.
 
Whoa, dude. That's a bit harsh! You're saying that if I provide a link to some code I've written (with or without AI) you'd be the judge on if I'd have enough clout to comment (contradict or counterpoint)?

I was in this code challenge ("parse 10,000 lines of numbers and provide a GCD...") with few heavy hitters, a few genius-level coders, and me. Timers started showing up (as they do) even though some were C, C++, F#, <whatever>, etc.. Fun all around talking about methods and stuff. ...C was in the lead because it was C and it was a serious-genius-level-full-engineer behind the code with some crazy nanosecond time ("second place" was really "first" when he was involved). But then all of a sudden some person we'd never seen before posts up a 20 line lisp and a sub-second time of like: 0.63. "yep, 5-10 minutes; coded on my coffee break. got any more challenges? that was fun". If you start creating "price for admission rules" you're going to miss out!
 
Whoa, dude. That's a bit harsh! You're saying that if I provide a link to some code I've written (with or without AI) you'd be the judge on if I'd have enough clout to comment (contradict or counterpoint)?

I was in this code challenge ("parse 10,000 lines of numbers and provide a GCD...") with few heavy hitters, a few genius-level coders, and me. Timers started showing up (as they do) even though some were C, C++, F#, <whatever>, etc.. Fun all around talking about methods and stuff. ...C was in the lead because it was C and it was a serious-genius-level-full-engineer behind the code with some crazy nanosecond time ("second place" was really "first" when he was involved). But then all of a sudden some person we'd never seen before posts up a 20 line lisp and a sub-second time of like: 0.63. "yep, 5-10 minutes; coded on my coffee break. got any more challenges? that was fun". If you start creating "price for admission rules" you're going to miss out!

1771296536485.png


Bro your not going to try and gas light me, your on ignore!
 
I’m not gas-lighting anyone but it’s your choice, man.

I do think I come with some pretty good one-liners every once in a while (at least I think so) though so you’ll be missing out on those.

L8r Sk8r

Everyone like my post; maybe he’ll see a bunch of likes on someone he’s blocking. :)
 
Please take me back, zester. I miss our talks so.

Wait a minute!? I posted a link to my repos and I still got ignored (I upheld my end of the bargain). Who's providing the "false narrative" (aka gas-lighting) now?!
 
this is the exact reason why our organization does not cooperate with United States based software services
Same here, multiple times. There are places where you are not even allowed to use the internet, and the local network is, well, airgaped and locked down otherwise. No code written in these places will ever see a public repo.
That’s not really true.
Oh yes, it is. Been there, done that.
But we are leaving the AI angle and getting into more bedrock problems of the state of the world.
I cannot see what you hope to accomplish by asking for tolerance while seemingly being so intolerant of those that disagree.
This is indeed a good question. Who will try an answer?
 
...

The anti-ai squad add them to your ignore list.
----
AlfredoLlaquet
atax1a
astyle
Espionage724
JohnK
jwillia3
MG
Zare
I liked the original version of the post before the edits. I’m not really comfortable with the idea of ignoring people, though! Even if we disagree, I think open discussion is healthier than shutting others out.
 
I liked the original version of the post before the edits. I’m not really comfortable with the idea of ignoring people, though! Even if we disagree, I think open discussion is healthier than shutting others out.
I updated it, they were upsetting me.
 
I sincerely hope others do not follow zester's ignore list.

I don't know why AlfredoLlaquet is on that list considering his thread of AI generated art.

Even though I disagree with AI use, I plainly stated I don't condone attacking its users. Perhaps, I am to be ignored because I disagree with his conduct and tone?

One should beware of anyone telling you to not listen to other people.

Let's also not forget that this is a FreeBSD forum not an AI forum. Ignoring people who disagree with one opinion only cuts you off from any help or enriching conversation you may have in the future.
 
It wonders me how emotional discussions about AI get, so that it is almost impossible to have a serious discussion about advantages, disadvantages, dangers.

I, myself, am an AI skeptic, but it wonders me what these LLM have achieved.

I sincerely hope others do not follow zester's ignore list.
I neither follow nor ignore anyone.
 
Announcing who you're ignoring, referring to people as "Bro", posting screenshots of your ignore list, etc, only puts your immaturity on full display. No one owns their thread... once it's in the public domain, you don't get to choose who replies. If you want to host an AI fan site and cherry pick AI fans, who agree with you, and ban "anti-AI" users, who disagree with you, then you need to host your own website for that or find a suitable venue.

This is the FreeBSD forums.
 
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