!!!!WARNING ALL FREEBSD DESKTOP USERS!!!! : Insane pkg's new version upgrade of installed apps

Y'know, assuming you are correct, and people are NOT supposed to be able to see even partial results, it would mean that pkg query would consistently return 'no packages available' given a list of details like uname -a, whether the user is on quarterly or latest, and the like.

But, it appears that a repo is allowed to appear on schedule, even if there are build failures (which leads to some missing packages). And that is visible to users if the package they query for is missing (but should not be! If a repo is visible, it's kind of expected to be complete... or at least reasonably complete).
I refer back to one of my previous posts- there are heuristics to avoid publishing a set that is far too broken, but obviously you'll win some and lose some. That's the nature of software- pkg or poudriere could probably handle something better here, but I don't think I've really seen any workable proposals (and certainly nobody willing to help out with It).
 
I guess the difference between success and failure is being willing to line up all those gotchas as discussed in this thread... Seems like it's not a safe assumption that they are all lined up by themselves.

It can take a lot of effort to line them up at the start - but that effort will pay dividends later.
 
I refer back to one of my previous posts- there are heuristics to avoid publishing a set that is far too broken, but obviously you'll win some and lose some. That's the nature of software- pkg or poudriere could probably handle something better here, but I don't think I've really seen any workable proposals (and certainly nobody willing to help out with It).
Well, rank-and-file users are seeing an awful lot of failures lately, and are getting disillusioned with those heuristics because of those failures. Not directly, but I was hoping that the packagers see that connection, and maybe try do something...
 
If true, that would mean that the "pkg upgrade" mechanism has only a reliability of 1-2 nines (about 90% to 99%). That would be insanely bad.

I just added the following comment to my post from a few days ago:
As per kevans (who knows), that is NOT how it works. There are much smaller vulnerabilities, if a small number of packages fails to build, but that is several orders of magnitude lower.

Which leaves the open question of what happened to the two people who wrote the original post in this thread.
 
Just did pkg update / pkg upgrade -- and it worked flawlessly !

I picked up around ~471 packages and made ~880 changes. And I (did not) have to manually recompile drm-61-kmod this time! Fantastic ! NVidia upgraded to 580.82.

Awesome job FreeBSD package maintainers !
:cool:
That a relatively small amount of packages that you have, My conclusion is more and more based on experiences that PKG utilitiy is not good at managing a big amount of packages and dependencies.

pkg info | wc -l
1566

and I have not been reinstalling the missing one yet, because of lack of time. In fact, I have been restored 16 packages since PKG is mess.
 
That a relatively small amount of packages that you have, My conclusion is more and more based on experiences that PKG utilitiy is not good at managing a big amount of packages and dependencies.

pkg info | wc -l
1566

and I have not been reinstalling the missing one yet, because of lack of time. In fact, I have been restored 16 packages since PKG is mess.
Just from one of the secondary installs (not even my main desktop which has way more pkgs, but I'm booted in Alt Linux ATM building 16.6.7 kernel for QEMU aarch64 Gentoo – it will take some time)
Code:
pkg info | wc -l
1768
Last time pkg wanted to remove something that I need was on Aug 22, and on Aug 23 pkgs were back in the repo. For the reference, please see posts #34 and #35 in the Thread 98903 .

Did you ever ask yourself "what else I need to learn to competently maintain my FreeBSD?"
There is a plenty of material to learn from around...
 
Maybe one of 'em broke his ! key? (Sorry, that was mean, but it makes me chuckle, so I'm leavin' it).
I'll be sure to laugh at you when you'll be the one facing issues.
Yeah, that's a proper spirit of OSS collaboration and helping fellow users /s

Do you have any idea to whom you responded? IDK scottro personally, but I learned so much from his posts here, and even more before on the other BSD related forums
 
Yeah, that's a proper spirit of OSS collaboration and helping fellow users /s

Do you have any idea to whom you responded? IDK scottro personally, but I learned so much from his posts here, and even more before on the other BSD related forums
I don't care whom you are or pretend to be. I surely didn't learn anything from his last comment here. Yeah, plenty to learn for sure. But is sound like if you want to do me a moral course here. Is it supposed to be my fault if PKG did that? Is PKG supposed to do that? Is it is intended behaviour to fuck up the installation? To say to the user, I'll do it and instead do something else ??? Sure I'm a just a newbie, a bad admin and I deserve to be laughed at plus having to be taught a lesson, that's the spirit of OSS, thanks. Good for you if you know a thing or two, I should know like you do, isnt it?
 
Sorry Useradd, I'm not getting drawn into a discussion/argument about exclamation points. Charlie Brown, I've already answered this post a couple of times, mentioning that my experience has been fine save for some Nvidia issues. So, I did make an effort to help. As for my comment, even at the time I said that my comment was kind of mean, so if you feel I owe you an apology, consider it freely given. There's already so much meanness in the world, I shouldn't add to it.
On the other hand, if you feel you shouldn't help me if I have a question, that is, of course, up to you.
 
I don't care whom you are or pretend to be.
Who or Whom?
I surely didn't learn anything from his last comment here. Yeah, plenty to learn for sure.
That's sad 🤷‍♂️
But is sound like if you want to do me a moral course here.
Personally, I don't give 2 eFs about morals, only thing that I do care about is ethics.
Is it supposed to be my fault if PKG did that?
Looks like it.
Is PKG supposed to do that? Is it is intended behaviour to fuck up the installation?
No and no.
To say to the user, I'll do it and instead do something else ??? Sure I'm a just a newbie, a bad admin and I deserve to be laughed at plus having to be taught a lesson, that's the spirit of OSS, thanks. Good for you if you know a thing or two, I should know like you do, isnt it?
IDK from where (that was discussed here) you draw up premises to come up with those conclusions, but I'm certainly not qualified to help you with any of that. I'm just a regular FreeBSD user and self-proclaimed OS tinkerer, so if you need help with your install, I'll be glad to help to the best of my ability.
 
Is it supposed to be my fault if PKG did that? Is PKG supposed to do that?

It's your responsibility to conduct yourself in a mature and respectful manner; especially in a place like the FreeBSD Forums. There's a great amount of prestige and influence attached to the name; and nonsense such as your ridiculous thread name doesn't add credence to it. You could've written a more mature post, submitted a linked bug report with it attached, and discussed the issue constructively with others. Do better.
 
It's your responsibility to conduct yourself in a mature and respectful manner; especially in a place like the FreeBSD Forums. There's a great amount of prestige and influence attached to the name; and nonsense such as your ridiculous thread name doesn't add credence to it.
LOL surely you are reference ! My ass too is prestigious. Am I the one going to troll on other's thread? if you do troll on my thread be warned you ll get what you deserve. I dont care. dont fuck with me.
 
There should be a banner warning on the top of the forum for shitty update like that. like !!!!WARNING ALL FREEBSD DESKTOP USERS!!!! If you care about your stable working installation, do not upgrade to PKG version ...
I used FreeBSD since 14.1 and afaik always used pkg. I have enough experience Win98/XP days to know any major OS upgrades will likely result in more troubleshooting than a clean-install to the updated version is worth :p

I last used 14.3-R-p2 and didn't find pkg an issue still, but don't know what might have happened after that.
 
I'm starting to think the upgrade issues some have are because of Linux behavior. "OMG an upgrade came out 3 seconds ago I must upgrade" instead of sitting and thinking "should I or should I not"
I think when it comes to PKG update and upgrade, which are two common basic administration command, no thinking of this kind should be necessary, unless PKG is to be classified as an unstable tool for managing packages. If not, then it's nothing else but confusing.

The purist and the sectarian, the conservative and the boomers getting offended by some exclamation marks from a newbie, I don't care.
PKG fail me and there was no reason for that.
 
I think when it comes to PKG update and upgrade, which are two common basic administration command, no thinking of this kind should be necessary, unless PKG is to be classified as an unstable tool for managing packages.
pkg(8) works just fine – TBH most of the time. For the very rare cases when it's not, there are numerus prevention and mitigation strategies already discussed here ad nauseam (and in the various other sites & docs)

If not, then it's nothing else but confusing.
RTFM and listen to the more experienced users to get some clarity on the matter.

The purist and the sectarian, the conservative and the boomers getting offended by some exclamation marks from a newbie, I don't care.
If you insist on using such approach to people and on offending them, you can – but don't expect any help down the road you are on, at least not from me.

PKG fail me and there was no reason for that.
🪞
 
there is no reason for PKG to have acted like this. I'm running 14.3 stable and I just did the update upgrade and reboot
Yes it have never failed either. There must be some warning after simulation regarding what will hapen and wait for confirmation before doing/installing anything. You could have avoid the mess. It may happen if some packge/s were deleted earlier and then failed to run pkg autoremove. You would have see the same warning.
Edit: There must be some learning curve and you are on it. You have learned something that PKG is old and long tested, never failed.
 
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