Solved Laptop recomendation for FreeBSD

MorgothV8

MorgothV8

Hi, I'm FreeBSD users since 1999.
I had multiple laptops, PCs and netbooks with that system.
My current netbook (Acer aspire one from 2010) is too old and 32bit only.
My main workhorse is Macbook Pro....
My last PC was sold 2 year ago (was FreeBSD on ZFS mirror)

Now I need some new laptop for FreeBSD only.
I need an advice, read lots of articles, and I see now choosing laptop is a lot more problematic that years ago.

Please help me, recommend some models.

Requirements are (from most important to least important)
1. Working Wifi (I have no other internet connection), at least in "g" mode,preferred "n" (but after reading multiple topics I see problem here)
2. Working full HW accelerated graphics: preferred **any** NVIDIA, even cheapest, and if not then Intel - but I saw multiple topics about problems with "kernel mode setting", no option to back to console once X started etc....
3. Working sound card - I expect no problems here
4. Multiple HDD drives, at least 2, I DON'T want SSD, of eventually one small SSD for system only, and 2 or more HDDs for data. Preferred just 2 HDDs >1TB. I'll make ZFS mirror from them.
5. Maximum possible RAM, at least 16G
6. Fast (not necessary fastest) AMD64 CPU, like Intel i5 eventually i7.

I'm software developer, working since 2004.
That laptop will be compiling a lot of python, c, c++, php code.
It will build lots of ports. Also I'll be editing a lot of graphics: Nikon RAWs, medium format photos scans etc.

Anybody recommend, advice any model meeting requirements?

Best Regards.
 
I'd recommend some Thinkpad W-series (W520 if you want the old keyboard, W530 if you can stand the new keyboard but want the old design, W540 otherwise as it has the best specs).
1. Wifi is usually from Intel, should work on FreeBSD OOTB.
2. W-series have NVIDIA GPU's. BTW, the problem with going back to console after X is started is gone when using vt(4).
3. Should work fine.
4. You can use Ultrabay.
5. There's max 32GB.
6. W-series have i5/i7 CPU.
 
WOW thanks, I'll check prices then, some if possible more info:
0. What is the problem with this "new" vs. "old" keyboard type? If "new" compatible with FreeBSD or something really strange (I've never seen problems with keyboard on *BSD)
1. Does intel wifi driver supports "n" or "g", if supports "n" then does it support 5 GHz ? (less important, but "n" would be great)
4. Ultrabay? I've read wiki and seems like it is some kind of hot-plug drive.... does it support multiple disks - like laptop already have HDD (for system) and in this Ultrabay put mirror of 2 disks for ZFS ?
Thanks for info, I'm researching W520 now....
 
If the wireless card does not work with FreeBSD, it can only be replaced with ones that are "approved" by Lenovo. Put a non-approved card in there, and the machine refuses to boot. Some HP models do this also.
Consider Dell or Acer, which do not lock the user into a small list of expensive wireless cards. (And neither of which have been caught putting man-in-the-middle SSL compromises on their systems, unlike Lenovo.)

https://wiki.freebsd.org/Laptops might be helpful.
 
Hmm, I know USB wifi is an option, but it would be best that wifi works OOTB.
Anybody confirms Intel wifi on W520 works? Which mode? "g" or "n"?
Also how about option to use two disks mirror? I'm paranoid about data loss.
A lot of data I have cannot be downloaded back from net, those are my programs, work etc.
So ZFS on 2 disk is minimal option.... would be best to have SSD "system" partition UFS, and then /data partition as geli encrypted mirror of two disks.
It MUST be encrypted, and FreeBSD ZFS doesn't support encryption (Solaris does) so additional geli layer is required (I used such set on PC two years ago)
 
MorgothV8 said:
Anybody confirms Intel wifi on W520 works? Which mode? "g" or "n"?
Click to expand...

Try and get one with the Intel NIC. The stock Broadcom NIC is garbage. The GENERIC kernel configuration has the driver for the Intel NIC (at lest the one in the W520) built-in, and it works great on my T520.

MorgothV8 said:
Also how about option to use two disks mirror? I'm paranoid about data loss.
Click to expand...

The "Ultrabay" pkubaj mentioned is the slot the optical drive fits into. You can remove the optical drive and replace it with a tray holding a second disk. There's also a mini-PCI-e slot under the keyboard you can fit an mSATA SSD into.
 
So unfortunately as I can see now:
-They can have either Intel or other wifi, and only "blessed" works, and most sellers don't know such details.
-Disks are mostly SSD, while I want "normal"
-Option to add another SSD disk is not for me...

I must choose other one, probably used - most new are SSD or brand locked etc.
Any recommendation for used one with my initial conditions, and because it will be few years old, then maximum parameters welcomed.
1. Working wifi in at least g mode, preferred n
2. NVIDIA graphics or other FULL supported
3. Two or more non SSD disks, or ability to add another disk to existing setup (not external)
4. At least 16G RAM, or ability to put 16 or more RAM (expandable to 16GB or more)
5. Inter i5 or i7, last resort i3 (but must have AESI instructions to hardware accelerate geli + ZFS mirror)

BTW: driver for wifi or graphics not necessary in GENERIC kernel, I'll compile my own anyway, and 3rd party drivers like ports + nvidia is no problem.
 
I have laptop for tests it is business series Lenovo ThinkPad E320:
http://www.partnerinfo.lenovo.com/p...ds/thinkpad-edge/E320_DS_ANZ_AU_15JUN2011.pdf
I have LAN PCI Express 2x2 11a/b/g/n Half Mini wifi according to present OS Win7.
I have it till Monday.
Started Live CD and wifi was not working.
I cannot erase win.
I'll start 10.2 installer from memstick and install onto another memstick and will playe with it.
Graphic is Intel integrated - shoudl be OK
Sound I will test
I got TP-Link external USB wifi too, maybe it will work?
RAM: 16G
HDD: (only one): 1T.
Anybody help with wifi setup?
Best Regards.

EDIT: TP-link external usb works as urtwn0
Half Mini is not, I'm trying NDIS now.... but cannot use laptop hdd, and swapping two USB sticks is a pain in ....

EDIT2: NDIS driver compiled, but cannot load due to missing resources, maybe conflict with USB wifi, will see next reboot, now I have many tasks to finish before I can reboot

EDIT3: no luck, driver bcmwl564_sys.ko is compiled, but not works:
Wen added to loader.conf it destroys USB a lot of usbd_ctrl_transfer_setup: could not setup default USB transfer
When not added to loader.conf, and no USB wifi attached, it still returns:
no match for ZwQueryInformationFile
no match for ZwCreateFile
no match for ZwReadFile
ndis0: <2x2 11/a/b/g/n Wireless LAN PCI Express Half Mini Car Adapter> mem 0xd1600000-0xd1603fff irq 17 at device 0.0 on pci2
device_attach: ndis0 attach returned 12
pci0:2:0:0: Device leaked IRQ resources
pci0:2:0:0: Device leaked memory resources

So only use TP-Link and urtwn0 is an option, and I'll go with it.

EDIT4: writting this already from FreeBSD 10.2 installed from usb memstick into USB pendrive only.
Installed chrome here.
I've also had problems with Xorg, two of them:
-X cannot return to text mode, when I use CTRL+ALT+F1 nothing happens, screen just ot update anymore, but I can return to X by CTRL+ALT+F9.
-When X started, touchpad driver was messy, reacting at random to my movements and doing random click, but when go to console mode (which didn't worked) and back to X it started to work OK.
Before all of that I did X -configure and put config file to /etc/X11/xorg.conf

Any ideas how to fix buggy touchpad driver (which recovers after mode switch) and how to enable returning to text only console?

I have no more strength today - already struggled for 7 hours.
Bye, please advice something if possible, so I will have starting point tomorrow:
-maybe some ndis advices, how to make it work?
-and those two Xorg problems....

mplayer and i965 works like a charm with -vo xv :)

EDIT5:
-Managed to fix X totally.
Read 'man vt', switched to full graphics (no text mode at all) vt with 1024x768 from loader.conf - both X problems are gone
-ndis seems to hard for me, seems like windows driver was generated, but it just cannot work, will skip that and use really small usb stick: TP-link wifi handled by urtwn0 without any issues (I'm on chrome on FreeBSD now)
-Will buy that laptop, with some hardware changes (the shop is able to do them for me)
-Current 1 slot 4G RAM will be changed to max possible 2x8G
-Current 350G HDD will be changed to 1TB
-Current i3 CPU (without AESI instruction) will be changed to i5 (with hardware crypto AESI in CPU --> I will have entire disk on geli)
Sound works OOTB, wired NIC too
 
wblock@ said:
it can only be replaced with ones that are "approved" by Lenovo. Put a non-approved card in there, and the machine refuses to boot. Some HP models do this also.
Click to expand...

This is what I have found as well. There are more laptops that whitelist hardware than people realize.

My recommendation is for Dell E6430 or similar Dell model.
A lighted keyboard is invaluable and would not consider buying a laptop without after using one.
 
The nice thing about Dell is they pre-wire the lid with both cellular and wifi antennas. Even on models without WWAN.

I would not consider a laptop with a "whitelist" an actual PC as it is fundamentally broken on purpose to defeat the customer.
 
I'll rather go with that E320.
All params but wifi are OK
RAM will be changed 4G --> 16G
HDD will be changed 320G --> 1T
Maybe CPU will be changed (will ask them) i3-2310M into i5-2410M (this supports AES-NI, maybe afte rBIOS upgrade)
Very little change, but I'll ask them to replace 2x2 Broadcom Half Wifi into Intel Centrino Wireless-N 1000 (even without this, the 1 cubic centimetre USB TP-Link wifi works already OOTB).

So only one problem remain active IMHO, that unfortunate ndis for broadcom (I took WinXP 64 drivers and compiled NDIS .ko - but it is not working on boot time and after boot too - why?)
Maybe I should compile DEBUG kernel, do some special logging and send You to examine - maybe this will help making usable driver for that crap Broadcom ndis?
 
Have a look at Asuspro models or Toshiba models?

http://www.neweggbusiness.com/product/product.aspx?item=9b-34-216-849

That's a really good deal, Intel video is in the works however...
Do note the Intel M-series CPU and not the U-series (much slower), Toshiba doesn't black/whitelist WIFI if you want to change and HDD caddys are available at ~30$ if you want to replace the ODD for another HDD.
Being the business model there's also a magnesium chassie and Intel LAN (ethernet).

//Danne
 
Well, I'll say that:
-I've visited all shops in my city (I don't want buy anything that I didn't test myself), I've only managed to get that particular ThinkPad.
And after about 9 hours of testing, and installing to USB stick everything works, only wifi is not detected, but TP-Link USB is just small and OK.
As I said, I'll just return this ThinkPad to the shop today - for change RAM, HDD and CPU and will be done.
So topic can be closed.
Thanks everybody for help.
I'll try a lot more with NDIS - maybe I'll succeed. But during the Mon-Fri I'm working most of the time, so next trials will be at weekend.

EDIT: just returned that laptop for hardware changes.
And WOW they have Intel Centrino Wireless-N 1000 chipset in the shop stock, so I've changed wifi too, and that model is supported by FreeBSD iwn :)
Willget that laptop back tomorrow with changed RAM, HDD and CPU.
 
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