Complete Noob

Peter Linu said:
You're all being so defensive! There's nothing wrong with FreeBSD. I just don't want to deal with its complexity at this end of my life. I much prefer the laughter of my grandchildren or the sound of great music or even the great feeling after a long walk.
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It is a FreeBSD users forum, so it's natural we'll be a bit defensive. Consider we will always advocate FreeBSD usage. Somebody being curious, then falling out quickly, will naturally ignite some responses.

However it's all fine and civil. People are trying to give their opinion that setting up FreeBSD for desktop usage on RPI isn't that hard and its just a few commands in the CLI away.

If you don't have time you don't have time, or will, and you certainly don't have to excuse yourself.

Personally, after a day of children's smiling, listening and playing music, and sports, last thing I want is to be greeted by some obscure error from my computer because it treats me like an average Joe. It is one of the reasons why I chose FreeBSD.

Peter Linu said:
As for RPi3b + 4b, They are both loaded with RPi's own O/S which while limited in scope/programs, both can web browse, email and write a letter which is 90% of what I ask of it.
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So the way I see it, you are looking for OS for old/vintage hardware that can still be used as a daily driver, end-user-friendly, and I think there are no better options than lightweight Linux distros you're already using :)
 
Also what we could try to do, is make a SD card image of already-setup FreeBSD for some Raspberry Pi, with the choice of software Peter would like to have.
 
Why not buy a real computer rather than trying to use a board meant to automate your lawn irrigation system?

Lenovo offers laptops and desktops preloaded with your choice of Linux or Windows. Enjoy life, no forum rants required.

Good day, sir.
 
Let's keep it simple. Has anyone successfully installed https://download.freebsd.org/releases/ISO-IMAGES/14.3/FreeBSD-14.3-RELEASE-arm64-aarch64-RPI.img.xz on a Raspberry Pi recently? If so, can they list the precise steps please? If no one has actually done this then any other suggestions, despite trying to be helpful, are likely to 'muddy the waters' and lead to frustration and wasted time.

I tried to install the image on a 2GB RPi 4 and it seems to hang at the multi-colored loading screen.
 
Useradd said:
Let's keep it simple. Has anyone successfully installed https://download.freebsd.org/releases/ISO-IMAGES/14.3/FreeBSD-14.3-RELEASE-arm64-aarch64-RPI.img.xz on a Raspberry Pi recently? If so, can they list the precise steps please? If no one has actually done this then any other suggestions, despite trying to be helpful, are likely to 'muddy the waters' and lead to frustration and wasted time.

I tried to install the image on a 2GB RPi 4 and it seems to hang at the multi-colored loading screen.
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I did use older FreeBSD images on various Pis. There were no steps other than burning the SD card. It boots into a full OS, there is no installer.

Which Pi do you have, exactly?
 
Useradd said:
Let's keep it simple. Has anyone successfully installed https://download.freebsd.org/releases/ISO-IMAGES/14.3/FreeBSD-14.3-RELEASE-arm64-aarch64-RPI.img.xz on a Raspberry Pi recently? If so, can they list the precise steps please? If no one has actually done this then any other suggestions, despite trying to be helpful, are likely to 'muddy the waters' and lead to frustration and wasted time.

I tried to install the image on a 2GB RPi 4 and it seems to hang at the multi-colored loading screen.
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joancatala

Solved Thread 'Rainbow on boot after restart Raspberry Pi 4'

Hi,
I have been using **FreeBSD-13** (i think) on the Raspberry Pi 4 since more than one year, but yesterday I restarted the raspberry (shutdown -r now) and I have the Rainbow on the monitor but I can't boot the system. I did nothing special, I didn't updated/upgraded the system or any important change.

I tried the solution of comment #11 on https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/...freebsd-13-install-on-raspberry-pi-400.79941/ but it doesn't solved the problem.
I tried another MicroSD card with Raspbian, in order to test the Raspberry, and it boots normally.
Could...
 
Peter Linu said:
Hiyall,
I have been a Linux user for 7 years and have enjoyed the ride and am now turning my attention to Free BSD.
I want to install it on my LEAST efficient hardware: Raspberry Pi 3b.
Please recommend:
1. Which format
2. Which O/S
Only safe and reliable, please.

Ancillary question: can it be installed in Linus Mint / Oracle VM VirtualBox?
Click to expand...
If you get curious to try FreeBSD again sometime, if money is not a problem for you, I would install an extra NVMe or SATA SSD in your desktop PC and install directly to that. This way you get a simpler installation, don't risk zapping your old OS (Linux?), get fast boot times and can just select the new FreeBSD disk to boot from in the PC's BIOS.

I'm a user of Linux since the 90's but prefer FreeBSD due to treating the ZFS file system as a first class citizen, unlike Linux with it's DKMS system.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
 
Peter Linu said:
Folks,
Thanks for all your serious and well-intentioned advice. I spent the whole day trying to get ANYTHING on the RPi3b & RPi4b. I was continually confronted with text and/or code. This is not what I want to do with the last 10 years of my life! I'm perfectly happy with Linux Mint and to a lesser extent, Puppy Linux. I didn't realise that FreeBSD is SO 'basic'.
So goodbye and go well.
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Peter Linu said:
I just don't want to deal with its complexity at this end of my life. I much prefer the laughter of my grandchildren or the sound of great music or even the great feeling after a long walk.
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You did not read the FAQs - it would have taken you less then 5 minutes to skim through them all.
Then you'd already knew:
"[FreeBSD] aims to offer a versatile platform suitable for a wide range of computing needs, from servers and workstations to embedded systems and beyond." [FAQ 1.1]
(Most) servers, and embedded neither need, nor want any GUI at all. Only user desktop machines use such - and also not every machine here does.
So, an automatic installation of a GUI with Window Manager (WM) or Desktop Environment (DE) by default makes only sense for desktop workstation operating systems, only. That would contradict the core idea of FreeBSD to be a multipurpose OS.

You did not read the first chapters of the handbook. Otherwise you'd knew the installation of a GUI can be done with just two simple commands.
I don't know how quick you think you may get to grandchildren capable laughing at you, but
a FreeBSD installation can be done by scratch under 10 Minutes.
Of course only with few, small packages for the start, a lightweight WM, only, and depending on the speed of the used drives, and of course depending on your knowledge.

Plus:
While you are still lacking most fundamental basics with the system, you already deal with advanced topics at the same time, like RaspPi installation, and ZFS.
Then complaining about the whole system. Of course people react defensively.
What did you expect?
"Yes. You are right. This (our) OS completely sucks, and we all use it only because we are a bunch of mad masochists."?
I told you: First things first. First get into the system a bit at all.

Many come to FreeBSD only experienced turn key OS so far, everything autoinstalling, and autoconfiguring automatically until a ready-to-use desktop appears with all pre-picked software also installed (Ubuntu, many other Linux distros.)
With FreeBSD you first have to decide if you want a GUI, then which one, and then install it yourself. Which is for every software that does not come with the basic, default installation. Vim, or emacs also need to be installed extra. Because by default FreeBSD comes only with vi and ee. Many have a problem with vi. So FreeBSD comes also with ee by default, too. A very simple, but no need to learn texteditor.
Since most use either vim, emacs, or another editor - most use one editor, it makes no sense to install all of them, or at least several pre-chosen ones by default, just to free the poor user from the heavy burden to pick and install one him/herself.
FreeBSD lets the user chose what he/she needs/wants, and then to him/her to install only what's needed, instead of trashing up the place with lots of garbage nobody needs, wants, uses, just for saving a few minutes of effort and gain a slight tiny unmentionable bit of comfort.
Downside: You need to know what there is, what you need, what you want, then pick it, and then install it yourself.
Which is most straight forward installation I know:
pkg install packagename - voilá!
Way easier than with all Linux distros I experienced. And more reliable.

FreeBSD is for setting up individual machines for individual needs. But this means a bit effort is needed. If you want to avoid that for the price to get some other one-size-fits-all, then this is okay. But then FreeBSD is not for you. There is no boilersuit mummy lays out ready for you to wear. You have to pick all your clothes from the (large) wardrobe all by yourself 😁:cool:
And it's completely up to you if you wear a bra, or not, a skirt, or trousers, or a kilt, or dress up like Ludwig XIV.

But if you take the effort, and learn it's no rocket science to set up a machine as you like it - your individual personal tailored machine - you may quickly come to the conclusion:"FreeBSD was the right choice."

All you need for that you find in the first chapters of the handbook, in these forums (e.g. how to get you graphics adapter up and running if it's not working at the first go), or how to get it on your RaspPi (
Starcat said:
trying to use a board meant to automate your lawn irrigation system
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😂)

You got a lot many pointers already in this - your - thread, to help you to get into FreeBSD.
And you wouldn't be the first one:
😤🤬🤪🙁🧐🤔😲🤓🥳😍👍👍👍

All you need is a bit more patience. After all FreeBSD is new to you, and it's not Linux.
Don't compare both, but start freshly all over, while a lot of unixlike things are already familiar to you, like shell usage. Just don't expect all have to work directly automatically by the first go on something you are new to.

:cool::beer:
 
As for the SD card image from the FTP mirrors, that works on my Pi4's. I've got two of them running right now. Just don't forget to decompress the xz image before you dump the bits to the card! That got me a few times in the past.
 
Maturin said:
Because by default FreeBSD comes only with vi and ee. Many have a problem with vi. So FreeBSD comes also with ee by default, too. A very simple, but no need to learn texteditor.
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I used nano for years on Linux and ee works great (used it exclusively 14.1 to 15.0)! I rely on a :qa prompt to exit vi if I accidentally enter it :p
 
Espionage724 said:
ee works great
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I sometimes get this feeling, we are talking of different ees when this topic occurs.
Are we talking about this one?
Code: 
^[ (escape) menu ^y search prompt ^k delete line   ^p prev li     ^g prev page
^o ascii code    ^x search        ^l undelete line ^n next li     ^v next page
^u end of file   ^a begin of line ^w delete word   ^b back 1 char ^z next word
^t top of text   ^e end of line   ^r restore word  ^f forward char
^c command       ^d delete char   ^j undelete char              ESC-Enter: exit
=====line 1 col 0 lines from top 1 ============================================



no file

ee does a very good job, yes, but I would not chose it as my primary main production editor.
I very much applaude the idea to have an additional, light-weight, most newby-friendly editor to basic installation besides vi, which for all non-vi/vim users can be a real deterrence when there is no other editor to deal with at the start, or in emergencies but vi. This is some advantage FreeBSD brings, not all unixlike OS do.
Personally I am a vim guy. And maybe it's just because I never gave ee a real try: Besides I find it a bit too undercomplex for larger tasks than just to do some small config file editing stuff, I find ee terribly slow.
Again: Maybe I missed something here.

However it does its job in most fundamental situations, like emergencies, and ee saved me my ass some times, too.
Anyway I don't want to start another editor-brawl.
The choice of the texteditor is very personal. It doesn't matter, which one you chose. As long as it does the job for you, you know how to use it efficiently, are satisfied with it, and as long it's an editor to be taken serious, which excludes MS Notepad 😂
 
Maturin said:
I sometimes get this feeling, we are talking of different ees when this topic occurs.
Are we talking about this one?
Click to expand...
Yeah! I do stuff like:

Code: 
ee /etc/fstab
  • Shift + Ctrl + V

Code: 
# Xfce
proc /proc procfs rw 0 0
  • Esc + Enter -> Enter (save)
Maturin said:
The choice of the texteditor is very personal. It doesn't matter, which one you chose. As long as it does the job for you, you know how to use it efficiently, are satisfied with it, and as long it's an editor to be taken serious, which excludes MS Notepad 😂
Click to expand...

Heh, I used Notepad when hosting nginx/php stuff on Windows :p Double-clicking stuff "in quotes" would select outside text oddly though so larger confs got Notepad++
 
VirtualBox
I downloaded the ...disc1.iso to add to my VB. I started the installation and mainly just went with the defaults except for choosing the UFS system. Got to the end, saved everything. It asked me to restart. I did. It took me back to the install page! What am I missing?
 
The story so far...
I managed to load GhostBSD into a VB and look around. I must say that it is quite primitive as far as desktops go without many of the 'niceties' that I'm accustomed to. The main one being a panel. I can't imagine that FreeBSD would be any 'friendlier'.

So back to my previous position...thanks but no thanks. I'll stick with Linux Mint / Puppy.
 
ralphbsz said:
For a beginner transitioning from other Unixes or from Linux, UFS is easier: The commands to format, mount and manage the file system are traditional. In the long run, ZFS is the far better file system.
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For anyone coming from Linux, UFS would be more familiar. UFS is akin to EXT4 -- EXT4 is extent based whereas UFS uses cylinder groups. Both have a similar feel. A Linux user will feel more at home with UFS.

ZFS is kind of like XFS on steroids. XFS predates ZFS by six years. ZFS is like XFS and LVM bundled together. Except that ZFS is 100 times easier to work with -- our team at $JOB manage 1400 Linux servers. LVM is a PITA. ZFS is a breeze.

But recovery, should something go sideways, is always easier with UFS. It's simpler. You can use a Swiss Army knife on UFS but you can't with ZFS (metaphorically speaking). It's much more complex internally. As UFS is simpler it uses fewer resources. The UFS buffer cache, as simple as it is, uses a lot less RAM than the ZFS ARC does. If you're planning on running FreeBSD on a Raspberry pi, UFS is your filesystem.

If you're running a large data farm with petabytes of disk, ZFS is your ticket.

Personally, all my systems boot off UFS while data resides on ZFS. It's how I managed my Solaris systems. And, my FreeBSD systems are clones of each other. All of my systems lineage trace back to the first few FreeBSD systems I had. I used that same approach when cloning Solaris and Tru64 UNIX systems back in the day, both of which used UFS (among other filesystems).
 
Peter Linu said:
So back to my previous position...thanks but no thanks. I'll stick with Linux Mint / Puppy.
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Peter Linu said:
the only programs I want are: web browser, email, word processor...that's it!
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No problem. You're welcome.
Since you've chosen the title of this thread well, some other newbies might take a look here. I always try to write my posts in a more general way, so also others, even not registered users may profit from it, since this is an open forum.

As I said: There is no shame in that at all.
That's what most people need their computers for. And since the most popular browsers, email clients, and LibreOffice are available for almost all OS, the OS you use doesn't matter then at all.
Let me guess: You also want to play games? Well, then on any other OS you would also encounter less troubles.

So yes, you are right, you'd best recommended with some turn-key Linux distro like Ubuntu, or OpenSuSe, (I like to recommend some FreeBSD bases turn-key OS, but I have no experience with neither of those), or Apple's MacOS, or MS Windows. They all provide exactly what you want: browser, email, word, (games), and no effort to install or maintain anything by yourself.😬

But this rises questions (no need to answer - I just wonder):
When that's all what you need, then why a RaspPi?
Websites heavily stuffed with multmedia crap are not running really smoothly on that little lawn sprinkler control, and it will sag at its knees at the latest when you do some medium sized doc on LibreOffice containing a few graphics.
Plus I don't trust the endurance of a sd-card like I trust real storage drives.
And above all:
Why did you look for another OS in the first place at all, when everything you need is already satisfactory available on your current system?
Personally I wouldn't change anything when it's all aces.
 
cy@ said:
For anyone coming from Linux, UFS would be more familiar.
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Not only coming from Linux.

UFS is a fully sufficient, fast, reliable, sophisticated, pleasing, while at the same time easy to setup, easy to use, and easy to maintain filesystem. I run it on both my laptop drives, and I would never think of running ZFS on a RaspPi sd-card.

Besides I don't really get it, why some people use ZFS on single partition pools - snapshots, I know. But besides I doubt that justifys all the downsides you get with ZFS, which produces all its benefits on raid configs, and AFAIK UFS is also capable of doing snapshots, there are other ways, and backups have to be done anyway - I always recommend people to start on FreeBSD with UFS.
Plus under some circumstances UFS is even faster than ZFS.

ZFS simply needs some learning. Of course, it's a great FS. No question. I use it myself on several machines and pools for many years. But it's for sure no beginners FS. One simply needs some experience in FreeBSD itself, before you start on ZFS. Trying to start new on both FreeBSD and ZFS at the same time is almost guaranteed to fail.
While there is absolutely nothing wrong with UFS.
I don't get it.
I believe many people don't think much ahead, underestimate needed learning effort while overestimating their expertise.
If people can pick free from anything available in the harbor, of course they chose the air craft carrier. Even if all what they really need is a rowing boat.
And that's doomed to fail: All you need is to get to the other side of the river. But instead to simply pull the Zodiac's Evinrude's cord, and just drive, they see themselves confronted with the topics of flight control, radar detection, steam catapults, and nuclear reactors, not knowing which is needed for just get vessel to move... 🤪😂:-/
 
Why? The grass is greener...! The RPi was simply finding out what it can do. I was ultimately disappointed because in its own way, it is a 'closed' system. And ur correct. It's for controlling lawn sprinklers. I have a friend who uses one to control the level of oil in his home heating system. So far it has broken down twice in 5 years and he was advised to buy a newer board! (shades of Apple).

Last night I installed the latest 64bit Pi OS on the 3b. Boy, does it ever run slowly! Think I'll install a 32bit OS and put it in storage.
 
Peter Linu said:
So far it has broken down twice in 5 years and he was advised to buy a newer board!
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This has nothing to do with it being a 'closed system' or not. It's just not economically viable to repair it, the labor cost alone will be several times the costs of a brand new PI.
 
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