An operating system (OS) is an interface between hardware and user

Having problems running your new shiny and blinking gadget or watching DVDs, listening to CDs etc.?

How to automount cd's dvd's thumbdrives

Postby topher » 01 Jan 2010, 07:26

The handbook has instructions for editing system files for enabling a non-root user to mount a device in a command line interface.
Typing "su" and entering a password isn't that much extra effort when mounting a device, considering a device must be located with "ls /dev | grep da/acd" then mounted with "mount" command at a mount point owned by the user.
I guess what I am saying is what is this obsession with typing everything in a command line to make it happen? I have a KDE 4.3, 8.0-RELEASE installation. When I put a cd or dvd in my drive the Device Notifier (installed on my panel by default) pops up a window with a "Devices Recently Plugged in" list and a label for that optical disc in that list. When I click on that label, dolphin opens with that same label in the "Places" sidepane. So far, so good.
Why do I get an error when I click on that same label in the dolphin side pane? Why can't I just view the contents of that optical disk when clicking on the same label in the dolphin side panel?
I have edited dvefs.conf, sysctl.conf, rc.conf, fstab, PolicyKit.conf. and rebooted enough! What is the problem with having a system that is ready to use after installation. Is it to school us on how it all works, that makes it necessary to edited 6 or 7 sytem files just to mount a optical disk upon insertion? Is it just a tease for the Device notifier to recognize that a disk has been inserted when there is no way of reading it without opening a terminal every time?
I honestly don't get it. Who is the target demographic for this operating system?
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Postby graudeejs » 01 Jan 2010, 09:51

topher wrote:I honestly don't get it. Who is the target demographic for this operating system?

Us....

We have no idea what kind of problem you have, because you haven't provided any error, no config files etc....
It can be everything.....
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Postby Speedy » 01 Jan 2010, 11:26

KDE is something in it's own. The problem you are having has very likely nothing to do with underlying OS. I had KDE in my wife's box. I got sick and tired of it when I tried to switch to new KDE 4.x. I just "upgraded" it to XFCE and all the problems are gone.
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Postby vivek » 01 Jan 2010, 11:32

topher wrote:I honestly don't get it. Who is the target demographic for this operating system?


Originally, it was for servers in data center. But, now it is suitable for desktop usage too as most open source software works under FreeBSD including X, OO, FF and much more. I don't edit all file just runs su - and type the commands. It is for smart people who wants to take control of their computer including software.
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Postby Alt » 01 Jan 2010, 13:01

An operating system (OS) is an interface between hardware and user
What is GUI (graphical user interface) then? Its PART of OS ??

I better say that Operating system its framework which gives API for other software to work on current hardware. Your Dolphin can mount CD and dont think which cd is it and how its connected. I dont think what going to happen on BIOS or hardware level, when i do `mount /dev/acd0 /mnt/cdrom` - OS gives me abstraction layer, so its 'interface', not window or icon manager.
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Postby Beastie » 01 Jan 2010, 17:06

topher wrote:I guess what I am saying is what is this obsession with typing everything in a command line to make it happen?

I edit [file]/etc/devfs.conf[/file] for device ownership and permissions (4 lines), create a [file]/etc/devfs.rules[/file] for USB and enable it in [file]/etc/rc.conf[/file], and finally enable user mounting in [file]/etc/sysctl.conf[/file] (1 line).
I don't use HAL and automounting. I have mount/unmount entries for all types of media in my fvwm menu so I only have to click these and it mounts the disk and opens a file browser automatically. Very simple and easy. Works perfectly well and I never had any problem.
I guess you could do the same with any WM/DE if you disable auto-mounting tools.


topher wrote:What is the problem with having a system that is ready to use after installation.

1. FreeBSD let's you configure your system as you want it.
2. Enabling user mounting by default is not a good idea security-wise, especially for servers -- the core business of FreeBSD.
3. It may not work with all WM/DE, which are BTW third-party applications not related to FreeBSD in any way.
4. Just like the current situation doesn't satisfy you, what you propose won't satisfy everyone (many of us).


topher wrote:there is no way of reading it without opening a terminal every time?

Leave the terminal emulator open 24/7. ;)


topher wrote:Who is the target demographic for this operating system?

The main target? Servers, definitely.
Another target? All who like to start from the ground up and setup and configure everything exactly as they like it.
May the source be with you!
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Postby Speedy » 01 Jan 2010, 17:11

One might say OS is the kernel. CLI is definitely an useful interface, often the only one. GUI is useful for desktops indeed.
But lets stop splitting hair.
Automounting is available in several levels. Kernel automount makes using remote NFS volumes convenient, for example.
If you are using a fully-featured desktop environment then HAL & Co does it for you. Don't blame your OS if it does not work to your liking.
For instance, in XFCE Thunar in daemon mode does automounting, HAL must be enabled. There is also a very easy to use plugin which allows to mount/umount just by a mouse click, no HAL needed.
I never figured out how it works in KDE. I'm not interested in it, either. HAL as a project is discontinued, too. :P
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Postby Beastie » 01 Jan 2010, 17:19

Speedy wrote:There is also a very easy to use plugin which allows to mount/umount just by a mouse click, no HAL needed.

That's what I do... without any plugin.
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Postby oliverh » 01 Jan 2010, 17:21

vivek wrote:Originally, it was for servers in data center. But, now it is suitable for desktop usage too as most open source software works under FreeBSD including X, OO, FF and much more. I don't edit all file just runs su - and type the commands. It is for smart people who wants to take control of their computer including software.


Well, originally it was an operating systems for scientific workstations and servers as UNIX per se. The so-called "Desktop operating system" is marketing-foo from Apple & Microsoft, nothing to worry about.
What was the goal of the Linux community--to replace Windows? One can imagine higher aspirations., Bill Joy
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Postby Speedy » 01 Jan 2010, 17:40

Beastie wrote:That's what I do... without any plugin.

:) This was just an example, XFCE specific.
In fact, I use OpenBox and do exactly what you do. ;)
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Postby topher » 01 Jan 2010, 19:17

I have tried PCBSD. From its name, I assume PCBSD targets Personal Computer users. PCBSD uses KDE4 as the default desktop and automounts anything that gets inserted. PCBSD is based on FreeBSD, so I thought that I could install FreeBSD and configure it to do the same.
I am not adverse to editing system files. My other OS is Arch with openbox as the desktop. I also use a terminal in Arch to gain super user authorization for updating and whatnot. I was born in 1947. Men of my age don't type with more than one finger. My first computer was a Commodore 128. I bought a 5 1/4 inch floppy of GEOS (Graphical Environment Operating System) and a 2 button mouse and never looked back.
I know automounting with the soon to be depreciated hal is possible with FreeBSD. I just can't seem to find any documentation on it. I prefer FreeBSD to PCBSD. I'd like to be able to configure my OS the way I like it. I have actually been able to automount USB devices by adding a PROC entry to fstab and editing PolicyKit.conf to allow me to mount removable devices. I'd like to be able to do the same for optical drives. If I insert an audio cd into my computer, I don't think I should have to then give my computerinstructions to access that audio cd.
"An operating system (OS) is an interface between hardware and user."
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system
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Postby topher » 01 Jan 2010, 19:36

Alt wrote:What is GUI (graphical user interface) then? Its PART of OS ??

I better say that Operating system its framework which gives API for other software to work on current hardware. Your Dolphin can mount CD and dont think which cd is it and how its connected. I dont think what going to happen on BIOS or hardware level, when i do `mount /dev/acd0 /mnt/cdrom` - OS gives me abstraction layer, so its 'interface', not window or icon manager.


http://www.google.com/search?source=ig&hl=en&rlz=1G1GGLQ_ENUS349&q=operating+system&btnG=Google+Search&aq=o&oq=&aqi=
"An operating system (OS) is an interface between hardware and user."
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system
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Postby Speedy » 01 Jan 2010, 20:00

Men of my age don't type with more than one finger.

Right, here's where autocompletion becomes handy. TAB in bash and ^D for root.
Regarding KDE, it's a bastard. I for one have no regard for a DE which does not read system conf files. (I learned new KDE ignores xorg.conf when it's present, do not know what else, I kicked it from my household.) :\
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Postby oliverh » 01 Jan 2010, 20:02



Well you've got your 'interface' it's called FreeBSD, an UNIX derivative. Now it's up to you to establish the connection with the interface.

Or to give you a short answer to your initial question:

>What is the problem with having a system that is ready to use after installation. Is it to school us on how it all works, that makes it necessary to edited 6 or 7 sytem files just to mount a optical disk upon insertion?


No! It is to please a variety of users. You can _build_ almost anything you like with FreeBSD. But _you_ have to do it, if you want the ease of use go PCBSD, if you wan't something different choose maybe some Linux-distro. There are enough possibilities in the world of FOSS.
What was the goal of the Linux community--to replace Windows? One can imagine higher aspirations., Bill Joy
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Postby topher » 01 Jan 2010, 20:09

Unfortunately KDE is where the bulk of new development in FreeBSD seems to be right now. I don't like it either, but I'd rather be able to have access to KDE's apps than run a WM that is better suited to Linux than FreeBSD.
"An operating system (OS) is an interface between hardware and user."
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Postby topher » 01 Jan 2010, 20:24

I think I'm begining to understand the lack of documention for automounting with hal in FreeBSD. Nobody wants to but me! This would also explain the total absence of any actual help in the replies to my post. So I guess I'm on my own.
I boot 4 OS's on my computer: FreeBSD, Arch, OpenSolaris and Haiku. I can automount to my hearts content with 3 of these. I want to make that all of them. If I am successful, I will post how I did it, that is, if anyone's interested.
"An operating system (OS) is an interface between hardware and user."
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Postby Speedy » 01 Jan 2010, 20:24

You can have KDE apps without KDE. Some supporting libraries will be pulled in of course. Don't know what bulk development you are talking about. KDE is not FreeBSD. I's getting ported to FreeBSD, yes. But it's still not FreeBSD.
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Postby topher » 01 Jan 2010, 20:37

Speedy wrote:You can have KDE apps without KDE. Some supporting libraries will be pulled in of course. Don't know what bulk development you are talking about. KDE is not FreeBSD. I's getting ported to FreeBSD, yes. But it's still not FreeBSD.


Its not Linux or OpenSolaris either. So I guess I'm missing the point, besides that you hate KDE and love FreeBSD. The bulk development I'm referring to is the number of new KDE apps available in the FreeBSD ports, is larger than say the number of new GNOMEapps.
"An operating system (OS) is an interface between hardware and user."
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system
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Postby Speedy » 01 Jan 2010, 20:41

Well, KDE is a stand-alone project. Not sure, but it may run even on MS Windows.
There are lots of GUI apps that just require GTK or QT. Not Gnome or KDE.
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Postby Dru » 01 Jan 2010, 21:20

Geez...what is it with people installing FreeBSD, and griping today.

Works great here, I guess my reply would be GFY.
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Postby topher » 01 Jan 2010, 21:37

Dru wrote:Geez...what is it with people installing FreeBSD, and griping today.

Works great here, I guess my reply would be GFY.


Thank you for your reply. What does "GFY" mean?
"An operating system (OS) is an interface between hardware and user."
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system
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Postby Dru » 01 Jan 2010, 21:42

Good Fresh Yogurt ;)
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Postby topher » 01 Jan 2010, 21:59

Dru wrote:Good Fresh Yogurt ;)

It sounds like you've had to explain this acronym before. Do you often reply to threads just to tell members to "GFY"?
"An operating system (OS) is an interface between hardware and user."
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system
"I use FreeBSD as my operating system and I'm pretty happy with it."
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Postby Speedy » 01 Jan 2010, 22:06

Good For You
Government Fiscal Year
Go Find Yourself (polite form)
Graphitic Filament Yarn

;)
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Postby DutchDaemon » 01 Jan 2010, 22:46

Play nice everyone, or I'll close this thread and you can all go FOAD. Ok?
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