Which file system do you prefer?

fender0107401

fender0107401

UFS or ZFS?

I like UFS, even though ZFS is a hot topic.

I thinks I will use UFS until it lost supports.

Seems, UFS is more native for FreeBSD.
 
UFS2 always for / and /usr filesystems, generally for whole FreeBSD's base system, also for small(er) systems that does not require a lot of storage space.

ZFS for large storage (often large multi disk arrays, like RAID1/RAID10/RAID5/RAID50/...).

I havent tried how ZFS copes with database (and generally very heavy random I/O) so I cannot speak here which one is better for that kind of workload.

ZFS all the way for large storage/backup pools.
 
Ditto to what vermaden wrote.

UFS for the base OS (basically just the binaries and libs) which is under 2 GB (CompactFlash and USB sticks are great for this).

ZFS for everything else, including /usr/ports, /usr/src, /usr/obj, /var, /tmp, /home, /usr/local.
 
sk8harddiefast said:
ZFS but still cannot setup my FreeBSD on ZFS. If there was an option on setup for ZFS or UFS (Like Solaris setup), I would choose ZFS.
Click to expand...

PC-BSD installer can install to ZFS. And it can be used to install vanilla FreeBSD.
 
PC-BSD installer can install to ZFS. And it can be used to install vanilla FreeBSD
Click to expand...
I prefer to stay to FreeBSD :) I like that comes without DE, grafical installer, grafical ports manager etc. I want to configure everything by own :) Also on FreeBSD, ZFS is possible. Just I have not the knowledge yet. I wish one day made it.
 
Even though UFS has a long history of reliability, ZFS is a huge improvement. Snapshots are a tremendous step forward and allow you to roll back to a previous state with just one command line. ZFS also supports compression and data integrity is incredibly well supported. Adding and removing disks from a raid is simple. The only way that you will lose data is by catastrophic failure of a single drive that is not part of a raid. Coming soon to FreeBSD and available now in the Solaris versions is deduplication.
UFS with Journaling is a step forward but it will never match ZFS for features.
 
Use the PC-BSD installer to install FreeBSD onto a ZFS filesystem.
Click to expand...
But this doesn't mean KDE too? I will download PC-BSD and run the setup into Vbox to see how setup is. That makes me confused is that PC-BSD is FreeBSD with GUI setup and default DE (KDE). Right? If I run setup, maybe have option for ZFS, but have the possibility of "minimalism"? I use fluxbox with ~ 550 packages for a desktop computer. If I have the possibility of minimalistic setup (to choose no DE, no packages etc. Just have ports and build them on console), that means that after setup, will be exactly the same as FreeBSD is when finishes his setup?
 
I really like ZFS for everything, though right now its ufs on /. When it comes to DB performance I'm not really sure which is better. Because what matters is how many transactions I can complete per second, not how fast I can read data.
 
sk8harddiefast said:
ZFS but still cannot setup my FreeBSD on ZFS. If there was an option on setup for ZFS or UFS (Like Solaris setup), I would choose ZFS.
Click to expand...

Are you not willing to try the manual ZFS install like the one on the FreeBSD wiki?
 
Are you not willing to try the manual ZFS install like the one on the FreeBSD wiki?
Click to expand...
I made a lot of tries in the past. I read a lot of tutorials, but always I couldn't copy my filesystem on the new hdd an destroyed my system, because the way to convert UFS to ZFS demands to change a lot of things on system and copy it (changed) in the new hdd. Failure means new fresh install. On me at least. Now I have a completely workable system (Only on wifi I didn't made it) so I am afraid to risk again.
If anyone have a easy tutorial to read and understand it, please post it to read it and ask question where I have problem, before start doing it.
Code: 
The real question is not: "Is FreeBSD good enough for you?"
The real question is: "Are you good enough for FreeBSD?"
"Don't ask what FreeBSD can do for you?
Ask what you can do for FreeBSD!"
I like that :)
 
sk8harddiefast said:
But this doesn't mean KDE too?
Click to expand...

:) Which part of "vanilla FreeBSD" in my first post was confusing?

The PC-BSD installer will install the exact same FreeBSD system as the FreeBSD installer will.

Or, you can use the PC-BSD installer to install PC-BSD, along with all their changes, KDE, PBIs, etc.

That makes me confused is that PC-BSD is FreeBSD with GUI setup and default DE (KDE). Right?
Click to expand...

PC-BSD is FreeBSD, plus some customisations, plus pre-installed and pre-configured KDE, plus their PBI installer, etc.

If I run setup, maybe have option for ZFS, but have the possibility of "minimalism"?
Click to expand...

As soon as you start the installer, it asks you whether you want to install PC-BSD or FreeBSD. Everything after that is the same (disk partition, filesystem set, network setup, install, etc). The only difference is whether or not you boot into FreeBSD or PC-BSD after the install is complete.

that means that after setup, will be exactly the same as FreeBSD is when finishes his setup?
Click to expand...

Exactly.
 
Blueprint said:
Why do you guys recommend UFS over ZFS for the base system?
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Much simpler diagnosing and fixing of problems.

It's very rare that a UFS filesystem will be unbootable, and you can use any LiveCD to fix one that is. It's not so rare to have a non-importable ZFS pool, and it's hard to find LiveCDs with all the ZFS tools for fixing one that is.

Once the debugging, diagnosing, and fixing tools catch up, then I may change my mind. :)
 
phoenix said:
It's not so rare to have a non-importable ZFS pool, and it's hard to find LiveCDs with all the ZFS tools for fixing one that is.
Click to expand...

If this is your main concern then surely your wouldn't want to use ZFS for your data pools either? Thankfully I haven't needed to fix a broken pool yet, but are there more zfs tools available in a working system compared to the Fixit environment running off the FreeBSD DVD?

I like being able to do ZFS snapshots on the root pool before doing upgrades.
 
I use ZFS for everything except swap which is on its own swap partition. I have no experience of UFS and the reason I use FreeBSD is mainly that I can use ZFS (I moved from OpenSolaris when it was killed by Oracle).
 
After rethinking setup from my HOWTO [1] and after phoenix thoughts I currently use that setup for most FreeBSD installations that include ZFS.

LOGICAL SETUP

Code: 
[SIZE="3"]UFS 512m /           ro
ZFS *    /home       rw | atime=off
RAM 128m /tmp        rw | async
UFS *    /usr        ro | softupdates (mounted r/w only for packages updates)
ZFS *    /usr/obj    rw | atime=off | checksum=off
ZFS *    /usr/ports  rw | atime=off
ZFS *    /usr/src    rw | atime=off
ZFS *    /var        rw
UFS 128m /var/db/pkg ro | softupdates (mounted r/w only for packages updates)[/SIZE]

PHYSICAL SETUP (LAPTOP w/ 1 DISK)

Code: 
[SIZE="3"]p1 8g disk0s1a 512m UFS /           newfs -m 1    /dev/label/root
      disk0s1e 128m UFS /var/db/pkg newfs -m 1 -U /dev/label/pkg
      disk0s1f    * UFS /usr        newfs -m 1 -U /dev/label/usr

p2 *g disk0s2  ZFS/home             zfs create -o mountpoint=/home      pool/home
               ZFS/var              zfs create -o mountpoint=/var       pool/var
               ZFS/usr              zfs create -o mountpoint=none       pool/usr
               ZFS/usr/src          zfs create -o mountpoint=/usr/src   pool/usr/src
               ZFS/usr/obj          zfs create -o mountpoint=/usr/obj   pool/usr/obj
               ZFS/usr/ports        zfs create -o mountpoint=/usr/ports pool/usr/ports

               (if You need SWAP, omit on CF/Pendrive/SSD disks)
               ZFS/SWAP             zfs create -V 2g                    pool/swap

RAM/SWAP 128m  /tmp                 tmpmfs=YES --> /etc/rc.conf[/SIZE]

PHYSICAL SETUP (CF + DISKS)

Code: 
[SIZE="3"]8g CF    disk0s1a 512m UFS /           newfs -m 1    /dev/label/root
         disk0s1e 128m UFS /var/db/pkg newfs -m 1 -U /dev/label/pkg
         disk0s1f    * UFS /usr        newfs -m 1 -U /dev/label/usr

*g ZFS   ZFS/home                      zfs create -o mountpoint=/home      pool/home
         ZFS/var                       zfs create -o mountpoint=/var       pool/var
         ZFS/usr                       zfs create -o mountpoint=none       pool/usr
         ZFS/usr/src                   zfs create -o mountpoint=/usr/src   pool/usr/src
         ZFS/usr/obj                   zfs create -o mountpoint=/usr/obj   pool/usr/obj
         ZFS/usr/ports                 zfs create -o mountpoint=/usr/ports pool/usr/ports

         (if You need SWAP)
         ZFS/SWAP                      zfs create -V 2g                    pool/swap

128M RAM /tmp                          tmpmfs=YES --> /etc/rc.conf[/SIZE]

Of course for serious storage/backup servers it would be 'nice' to have that CF (or pendrive) mirrored via GEOM/mirror.

[1] http://forums.freebsd.org/showthread.php?t=12082
 
i I like the simplicity of ufs. i I made my backups, and what needs a version control gets mercurial, thats that's it. to To me [this] is a little overkill. it It seems also that zfs fails a lot, from the number of posts in tthe formus at least. i I am not an expert from any point of view but that is my opinion rigth now.

Cheers,
cuq
 
Copy-on-write might be nice for ufs, but I'm not going to move to zfs for that. The rest of it is all in that "Well, don't that beat all!" category.
 
sk8harddiefast said:
But this doesn't mean KDE too? I will download PC-BSD and run the setup into Vbox to see how setup is. That makes me confused is that PC-BSD is FreeBSD with GUI setup and default DE (KDE). Right? If I run setup, maybe have option for ZFS, but have the possibility of "minimalism"? I use fluxbox with ~ 550 packages for a desktop computer. If I have the possibility of minimalistic setup (to choose no DE, no packages etc. Just have ports and build them on console), that means that after setup, will be exactly the same as FreeBSD is when finishes his setup?
Click to expand...

Freebsd FreeBSD wiki, forum, handbook have enough information on how to install root on zfs. i I have tested and it works :) i am followed these I followed this guide: http://wiki.freebsd.org/RootOnZFS/GPTZFSBoot/Mirror, and i I am also just learneding freebsd FreeBSD and zfs for 3 weeks with much help from good fellow in freebsd FreeBSD forum, irc channel(s), handbook, manual. you You should try it, it's really not that hard to grasp the basic idea of zfs.

I am using these this zfs setup for my squid, dns, and snort server which is works great until now.
 
Until recently, my line of though was "data on ZFS, everything else on UFS".

Then, I started building most of my servers to boot from USB FLASH drives.

Then... discovered that ZFS on an USB FLASH is way faster (because of aggregated writes), than UFS. In situations like this, you realize that UFS is sort of primitive...

So, now, my only use for UFS is on memory constrained systems, or other cases, where ZFS is not an option.
With ZFS now working very stable without any tuning, having better performance and higher reliability this is not difficult decision. Of course, there is the learning curve, but the interface to ZFS is not complex.
The integrated volume manager is hard to beat.

I even do swap on ZFS, without (much) ill effects :)
 
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