Introducing Tredly - Containers for Unix (FreeBSD)

perkypork

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The team who created Vuid (vuid.com) would like to announce the release of Tredly (tredly.com) - containers for Unix (built on FreeBSD).

After a number of years in development, as of today Tredly has been made available under the MIT Open Source license.

Tredly was created by the team at Vuid to give the business software platform they built, a production ready container solution built on FreeBSD.

Unlike some other container solutions, Tredly is a full stack solution, providing all the benefits of containerisation and the operating system environment to build and run them.

You can download Tredly from Github - https://github.com/tredly.
You can learn more about Tredly at http://www.tredly.com

On Github you will find:
* Tredly-Host (the operating system to run Tredly containers)
* Tredly-Build - the software that validates and builds containers (based on the Tredlyfile)
* Example containers to get you started.
New products and features for Tredly will be released as we port functionality developed for Vuid over to Tredly.
 
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drhowarddrfine

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Aren't FreeBSD jails far superior to this? What is the advantage of third-party software over FreeBSD maintained jails? What is a "Tredly container", "Tredly Host"?
 
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perkypork

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Aren't FreeBSD jails far superior to this? What is the advantage of third-party software over FreeBSD maintained jails? What is a "Tredly container", "Tredly Host"?
FreeBSD Jails forms the basis of Tredly, we have simply expanded upon them to allow them to be completely programmatically created (using a Tredlyfile). We mention jails a number of times on the tredly.com and in the documentation. I guess your question is why say container when we could say jail. Developers created this software for other developers and developers understand what container means more than they understand what a jail is.

EDIT: added this - We mention jails a number of times on the tredly.com and in the documentation.
 

Zirias

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So it isn't a container solution on its own but yet another set of automated jails management tools?
 
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perkypork

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Zirias

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I think we are splitting hairs in this regard.
Not really. But I guess you missed the point. It's not about the term "containers", that's fine. And I didn't have a look at your project, it might very well be just fine and do some things better than others.

But the way you described it gave the impression you created your own containers solution. And as FreeBSD does have a very mature container solution (namely, jails), drhowarddrfine asked why not use them instead. People who know FreeBSD will know jails. So put it in your description to avoid this kind of confusion.
 

forquare

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After a number of years in development, as of today Tredly has been made available under the GPLv3 Open Source license.
This is an interesting choice. May I ask the rational of the licensing?
 
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perkypork

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This is an interesting choice. May I ask the rational of the licensing?
I have answered this question elsewhere so in the interests of keeping things the same - "Not 100% sure to be honest. We went with GPLv3 because that was the license our open source (experienced) developers wanted."

To add to that comment - I was personally interested in releasing Tredly open source (didn't really mind under which license) because I do not think FreeBSD gets the love it should. I would like to have more developers use it and the best way to do that is to give them something that makes their work day that little bit easier.
 
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perkypork

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Not really. But I guess you missed the point. It's not about the term "containers", that's fine. And I didn't have a look at your project, it might very well be just fine and do some things better than others.

But the way you described it gave the impression you created your own containers solution. And as FreeBSD does have a very mature container solution (namely, jails), drhowarddrfine asked why not use them instead. People who know FreeBSD will know jails. So put it in your description to avoid this kind of confusion.
Sorry if you were confused, that was not the intention. Thanks for bringing it up so that any confusion could be clarified.
 

ANOKNUSA

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I have answered this question elsewhere so in the interests of keeping things the same - "Not 100% sure to be honest. We went with GPLv3 because that was the license our open source (experienced) developers wanted."

To add to that comment - I was personally interested in releasing Tredly open source (didn't really mind under which license) because I do not think FreeBSD gets the love it should. I would like to have more developers use it and the best way to do that is to give them something that makes their work day that little bit easier.
That license alone could be the weak point in your marketing strategy and your wish to promote FreeBSD. People are going to be quite curious why you created a project built upon FreeBSD technology, in the hopes of promoting the FreeBSD operating system, and then released its code under a license many FreeBSD users and developers find objectionable and incompatible with their own goals. Near as I can tell, you chose the GPL for wholly arbitrary reason, that reason being that it's just the one everybody knows about. But think about it: you chose to use the GPL. You did not use it because you were obligated to under threat of a lawsuit and damage to your professional reputation. And you could only make that choice because you used code released under a free license that gives you that choice, rather than a license requiring you to fall in line with the ideology of the person "sharing" the code.

The other thing to consider is this: suppose you actually innovate the FreeBSD jail concept in such as way that many people---even the FreeBSD developers responsible for the jail code---consider it to be even better than what now exists. FreeBSD could never benefit from your innovations by incorporating them into the operating system, because the GPL is legally incompatible with any code that is not itself GPL-licensed. You've created a product built upon FreeBSD, for the supposed benefit of FreeBSD, that cannot legally be part of FreeBSD.
 

Zirias

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Although I first wanted to have a look at the software itself (and I'll probably do that to evaluate whether it also suits my needs that's just using jails for lightweight virtual servers), I thought about writing something similar like ANOKNUSA. Well, now most things to consider about the GPL is already there, I just want to add one more point:

You're mentioning business software. A key element to actually help people is that the software gets well-known in the first place, and that means, the more users, the better. At least where I work (creating business software), we avoid GPL software at all cost. And we don't even publicly release our software, it's only for internal use. Still, GPL is a no-go, according to our chief architect. It just has so many legal pitfalls, he says it's not worth the risk and better spend some time to a) look for an alternative using a free license or b) create it yourself if nothing is available. This might be overly paranoid, but I can understand it and could imagine other organizations have similar policies.
 

sidetone

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It depends on what your business and market strategies are for the license to be chosen. As mentioned above, a GPL license won't promote FreeBSD so much. However, it will take heavy thinking to decide which license fits your goals, and if those goals are aligned with promoting FreeBSD. It seems your developers said they like a GPL license, so perhaps they think that benefits their business strategy? GPL has a restraint where it is limited in using different programs with various open source licenses it can be combined with. Perhaps you want to investigate LGPL, if it is your goal for your business and not to promote FreeBSD through that program.
 
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perkypork

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Thank you to everyone giving feedback, its always appreciated. The license we have chosen is something we have received a large number of comments about. Its definitely something we are looking at. Trying to balance the pros and cons of licenses is a difficult one.

We are taking on board your comments and discussing them as time permits.

We are continuing to release new Tredly features, with the API and CLI released last week and the Web Management interface to manage multiple Tredly-host's going internal alpha late last week. Tredly-Host has a number of updates in Integration which we are testing.

Tredly Docs went live last week though we are still in the process of collating them all.

A Tredly VM will go up soon - I will come back and update.

You can follow Tredly on Twitter to get the latest updates.
 

NewGuy

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I think it's nice Trendly is working on something that seems to mix the power of FreeBSD jails with Docker-like set-up. That seems like a good idea. Like others here, I find the license a curious (and unpleasant) choice. I try to avoid using GPLv3 software whenever possible and I wouldn't risk distributing anything that touched a GPLv3 license.
 
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perkypork

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There will be a bunch of updates to Tredly tomorrow:
Based on community feedback (thank you for your in-depth feedback) we will be changing the license of the news versions to MIT - check the updated code tomorrow.

I am hopeful that I will be able to release screenshots of Tredly Command Center tomorrow. Tredly Command Center will allow you to manage multiple Tredly Hosts.
 

lme@

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That's great news! :)
 
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perkypork

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I think it's nice Trendly is working on something that seems to mix the power of FreeBSD jails with Docker-like set-up. That seems like a good idea. Like others here, I find the license a curious (and unpleasant) choice. I try to avoid using GPLv3 software whenever possible and I wouldn't risk distributing anything that touched a GPLv3 license.
Lucky we are changing the license then.
 
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perkypork

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Thought I would come back with an update. We have released a number of updates to Tredly to fix some bugs and add some new features. We have also released:
1. Tredly API which allows you to manage your Tredly servers remotely using a HTTPS API.
3. Tredly CLI which allows you to manage your Tredly servers via console on your computer.
2. Tredly Command Center a web based management UI so you can manage one or more Tredly servers.

In the coming week or so we hope to release Tredly Version 1 and soon afterwards add in a bunch of new functionality.
 

dch

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where's Tredly at present? It looks like it has the makings of being the best FreeBSD container experience out there, but there's not much repo or blog activity happening. Anything exciting you can share?
 
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